Author Topic: March 14 - LongTimeUnderdog - The Canticle and The Forge, Chapter 11 (third draf  (Read 1920 times)

LongTimeUnderdog

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Chapter 10 - Jin is rescued at the Bazaar by Chalinae.

Chapter 11 - Jin suffers the consequences.

RiaRaen

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Hey^^
So I havent read any of the earlier chapters only 10 & 11 but if you could send me the earlier ones im sure it would answer some of the questions these chapters have raised for me.
I really like 'the memories of myself' of i am very intrigued by the background to this as I was very confused by what his sensitives are and where exactly on his body they are placed.

'She strung a veil of black silks was placed over my face and all light was now gone from my world.' should this read 'She strung a veil of black silksover my face and all light was now gone from my world' as it didnt quite read right as it was.

I did not know it at the time, but they changed my clothes - I found it odd that he wouldnt realise they were changing his clothes as surely he would have felt something?

I was also surprised to discover that Jin wears glasses as this wasnt mentioned in chapter 10 and they would have caused some issues for him being knocked about in the dirt, either being knocked from his face or getting broken maybe.

gold frames pressed tightly behind his ears needed cleaning and even if they cleaned, he was still too far away to make out any of the - again it doesnt quite read right maybe 'and even if they were clean'

He squeezed his way out of you and had it all. - Just wanted to say that I love this sentence and it really added to the characterization of his father

The couch sat in the far back corner.........  I skimmed this paragraph as it just seemed to much description all in one go and broke the action of the story.

Jin hated when Talvin ignored his precense. - again really like this sentence it told me alot about there relationship in so few words especially Jin calling his father by name.

The chill from the cooler air inside the House branch had already faded.- I wasnt sure what you meant by branch

 'causing the heat to bake said waste and make it smell even worse' for some reason I just dont like the word 'said' when used in this context it makes it sound pompous I would just use 'the'

So back to my earlier point about the specs you mention them alot in this chapter which just makes it even more odd that they werent mentioned in 10. Knowing about the glasses has somehow altered my perception of Jin and how I imagine him which destroys the image I had from the previous chapter. So I would recommend using them in 10

ďEeeehh,Ē he screamed, tumbling to the side.- another little gem, I laughed out loud at this

pick up wet grass, or dirty grass. - you then go on to refer to it as straw. I would use one or the other

I have to admit I did start skipping parts of the stable duty as it seemed to go on for a while but the story picked up again nicely after that. The dialogue in this story is great, each character really has their own voice and your descriptions really set the scene although some are too long and ruin the pace. Im intrigued to see where this goes.

I look forward to reading the earlier chapters and the ones to follow

MannyBrainpan

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I just read Chapter 11. As I read it, I forgot that it was not the beginning of a story and had no idea about certain words, so I kept making note that stuff wasn't explained. I liked the chapter though, I don't really know much about the character so it was hard to like him at first, but now I do. Like the previous poster, I found the stable scene to drag. Another thing, in the opening scene when Jin's parents are trying to decide his punishment, you describe the house setup extensively. I REALLY wanted to skip over those bits (but I didn't) and it made me lose interest in the scene. If you were to maybe show that Jin was distracting himself for a while and started looking at the way the house was setup. Also, I don't know who your projected demographic is, but frankly, having topless women in your story often is not...um...appropriate for a YA novel, which this appears to be. Have you read the Inheritance Cycle, Paolini handles said issue very well. Anyway, I liked the world you have created, it was a little sluggish in places, and I found a fair bit of awkward sentences (some pointed out above.) Anyway, keep writing, and I hope to see the next chapter soon.  And if you would like, I can email you an edited version of your chapter.
"It's a liger... it's pretty much my favorite animal." - Napoleon Dynamite

LongTimeUnderdog

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Thank you so much for the feed back.  As to he concerns with this being YA . . . well if you consider works like "Ender's Game," "The Painted Man," or "The Name of the Wind," to be YA then I suppose this story falls into that category as well.  But I, personally, have never considered them to be YA.  But then . . . if they really do fall into that category . . . I should really start moving toward that demographic then.  Thanks for the heads up, and the critiques.  Very helpful stuff.

akoebel

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Hi,

I had some trouble with the epigram : there are many elements here that I suppose are explained in the earlier chapters, but the sensitives/parts and such did confuse me (especially in the sentence "Realizing the futility, they ceased their attacks and laid limp inside.", which I suppose refers to the sensitives/parts).

The scene with the parents started well, but when it came to the couch part, I felt a rupture in the story : you have this big descriptive paragraph sandwiched between two parts of the same dialog. BTW, having glasses made of gold doesn't seem like a good idea, since gold is a very malleable metal.

The scene at the stables was kind of fun to read, but at some level, I began to wonder what did it bring to the story. Considering that this is supposed to be chapter 11, scenes shouldn't be about character exposition anymore and bring something to the story.

The last part with Chalinae did raise some questions for me : I don't know her that well, but sending her "man" to a life-threatening errand just to have him do something manly didn't feel in character to me. She implies she wants her man to be smart, and mostly wants to reassure the world that her choice of man is right. Sending him do something stupid for a feather doesn't seem right to me.

All in all, I liked the chapter. I got from the voice that Jin is the scientific type : that was well introduced.

LongTimeUnderdog

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Thanks so much akoebel.  You've given me a bit to think about.

Asmodemon

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Again I liked the excerpt from Memories of Myself, though parts read a little confusing. Iíll go into that in a moment. The chapterís basically three sections, the reprimand, the stables, and Jinís downtime. The reprimand shows Jinís relationship with his exasperated father very well. I donít really see much point in the stable scene, other than have Jin suffer. From what I remember of your writing you donít need to spend extra effort now ;)

The chapter wanes until we get to Jin overhearing the girls speak. We get another new word, Pai'asie. I have no idea what this is supposed to mean. On its own thatís fine, but you already have a lot of new words that need to be understood. The last scene I liked as well, though Chalinaeís challenge seems foolish, but sheís not much older than Jin and kids will be kids.

Some further remarks, some of what you write is pretty confusing, you seem to change your mind halfway through a sentence. Two ways of saying the same thought in one sentence doesnít really work. I think Iíve mentioned this before. The first example in this chapter is:

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She strung a veil of black silks was placed over my face and all the light was now gone from my world.

The two variants I see are:

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She strung a veil of black silks over my faceÖ
And
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A veil of black silks was placed over my faceÖ

Something for the proofreading step to fix perhaps, but it might be a good idea to pay a little more attention to it since it happens fairly often.

You write very descriptively, I know I do the same, but Iíve found I often have to cut out a lot of nicely worded descriptions because it brings the pacing way down. Especially when the descriptions occur between parts of the same person speaking, for instance with the couch part at the start of the chapter. Iíd cut that description off after Ďgoing over scrolls and tabletsí and get back into the dialogue. At this point we donít need anything more than placing Jinís mother on the couch, the rest of the information isnít pertinent as far as I can see.

About Jinís glasses, I donít remember them from the last draft you did (which is fine) but I also donít remember them being mentioned in the last chapter (I checked, and this is not fine). Jin notes things there as if he can see everything just fine, but here he canít see the writing on the papers clearly without glasses. Maybe his eyesight is only a little worse than normal, but it momentarily takes me out of the story so you may want to clarify this.

Another thing I thought of when Talvin was reprimanding Jin is that Jin was easily confused for a slave. For a society that spends so much import on Free Men and slaves, youíd think theyíd either mark the slaves VERY clearly or/and have a clear way to signify a free man from a slave, either with a marking or a badge or something.

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But then . . . if they really do fall into that category . . . I should really start moving toward that demographic then.

I donít think you need to move or change the story to a YA demographic. Sure, your main characters are young, with Jin being ten years old, and young protagonists are often seen as a sign of YA, but by that logic with a ten year old character this story is also middle grade ware. I agree with you that the Painted Man is not YA, not by a long shot, and neither is this.