Author Topic: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)  (Read 12561 times)

Cheese Ninja

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2010, 10:08:35 PM »
It seems like if Kaladin made 10 clearmarks in 2 weeks, and an emerald chip is "more than he normally made in 2 weeks" then an emerald chip would have to be worth more than 8 clearmarks. Or are you assuming he's referencing his net income after the bribe?

It bothers me too.  I can't find any place where the broam/mark conversion rate is mentioned specifically.  I'm just assuming its the same as the mark/chip conversion rate.

If it was 4 marks to a broam, then emerald marks would be worth 50 diamond marks, and emerald chips would be worth 10 diamond chips.  Which I still don't like.

Never

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2010, 06:27:37 AM »
I expect a resurgent interest in marbles, should Kings cosplay ever properly take off.   ;D

I checked already, couldn't find glow-in-the-dark marbles.  ;)

Just google it
« Last Edit: September 26, 2010, 06:30:56 AM by Never »

Inkthinker

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2010, 06:42:20 AM »
If you can think of it, somewhere on the internet there's a website for it.

Glow-in-the-dark marbles seems like an easy one.

If you use a black light, then Vaseline Uranium marbles glow in the dark...plenty of them on sale on Ebay.  Not too expensive, either, but they just glow...they don't have a color chip in the middle, and I'd expect the chips would glow the color of their gemstone.

Man, in cosplay you gotta work with what you can work with. One of the coolest things I saw at Dragon were the Mistborn with the vials of metal suspended in alcohol... sure, it was all Goldshläger, but that's not quite the point. It was little bits of gold you could drink.

Someone comes up at the next Con with a pouch full of glowing spheres, and the last thing I'm likely to say is, "nice, but they really ought to glow different colors, and only in the little gems in the center, and aren't these a bit too large or small?"

Hell no! Glowy spheres! Kick-ass!

I like the idea of using a tiny black-light at the bottom of the pouch, but do they make tiny little LED UV lights? 'Cause I figured that's what you'd need to use, something small but powerful that can be placed at the bottom to shine up and through. Of course, they effect will be lost if you take the spheres out...

« Last Edit: September 26, 2010, 06:48:33 AM by Inkthinker »

Terez

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2010, 06:35:21 AM »
I just finished the Wiki article on currency a few days ago. Best quote I could find on the value of broams was that an emerald broam was worth 'hundreds of lesser spheres'. Of course, the denomination and gem type of those lesser spheres is not specified, so that doesn't help much.

As to the 9 gem types used for currency...was able to verify 8 of the 9. Not sure if heliodor or smokestone is the 9th.

Also, I have no idea how the gems relate to each other beside the fact that emerald is highest, diamond is lowest, and since a garnet is worth five times a diamond, it's probably the next-lowest. Sapphire is 25x a diamond, but not sure if there are other gems in between sapphire and garnet.

Also, many spheres are flattened on one side so they won't roll away, so they wouldn't make very good marbles.

Cheese Ninja

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2010, 08:39:02 AM »
I agree, since she was talking about emerald broams specifically, that it's not a particularly useful quote.  I think broams are probably worth a 4 or 5 times their respective marks, but that still makes Kaladin's remark about an emerald chip being worth more than 2 weeks of wages sound wrong to me.  Unless he's talking about after Gaz's bribe, then 4x would work fine.

If a ruby mark is equal to a weeks worth of wages for a sailor, and a sapphire mark is a week's worth of wages for a soldier, I really think ruby would be between sapphire and garnet.

I mean, aren't soldiers usually better paid than sailors?

Fireborn

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2010, 08:59:06 AM »
Looking at the quote saying that Shallan used all nine colors of sphere, I think she means actual color, I don't think she counts white in that, so that would be nine colors plus white, and so we're back to ten types.  This really makes the most sense.  I mean, why wouldn't they use all ten types of gem as currency?  Why exclude one?
When to live is to die, and to die is to live, does either really matter?

Munin

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2010, 02:32:26 PM »
Looking at the quote saying that Shallan used all nine colors of sphere, I think she means actual color, I don't think she counts white in that, so that would be nine colors plus white, and so we're back to ten types.  This really makes the most sense.  I mean, why wouldn't they use all ten types of gem as currency?  Why exclude one?
It might have something to do with Talenel.
There's a difference between what's best and what's right. What's best might be different tomorrow or the day after, but right and wrong will stay the same after a thousand years.

11thorderknight

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2010, 12:30:45 AM »
I've trying to figure out the sphere value system, here's what i've come up with so far.

diamond is the cheapest gem
emerald is the most valuable
garnet is worth 5 x diamond
sapphire is worth 25 x diamond
emerald is the most valuable gem, and is worth 40 x diamond
therefore, emerald is worth 1.6 x sapphire (i think this would make sapphire the 9th most valuable)
ruby is probably a bit less than sapphire (a ruby mark is a week's pay for a sailor, a sapphire mark is a week's pay for a soldier) but i can't imagine the difference is huge, so ruby is probably 8th or 7th most valuable

when Shallan thinks about 9 colors of gems, i'm sure she includes diamonds. But, garnet and ruby might be considered to be the same color. Also, we don't know what color the zircons in this system are (real zircons have lots of colors).

it's implied that a gem's value is directly related to the usefulness of what can be Soulcast with it (emeralds are valuable because they can make food). but that doesn't totally make sense. if that's true, why are diamonds, which make glass/crystal/quartz, so much less valuable than the rest? why are sapphires, which make air, of all things, the 2nd most valuable?

also, the gems themselves never get directly used in Soulcasting, because they can't be put into Soulcasters. So, they must just transfer their stormlight to the gems set into Soulcasters. Does this mean that stormlight can only be transferred between the same gems? or is the whole value-related-to-Soulcasting thing a mistake?

Cheese Ninja

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2010, 04:33:24 AM »
Ah, you're saying things backward, you mean that you think sapphire is the 2nd most valuable, and ruby is 3rd.   I don't agree with that, because there's too much space between their supposed values, given the wide variety of gems that we have.  On the other hand, when Shallan was buying those books, the man responded with "Two emerald, three sapphire" which would be most natural if, like you said, it was the next most valuable denomination.

I also assume that soulcasting usefulness isn't the only thing determining relative worth of the gems, their respective rarities are probably a big part as well.

So far I'm not a big fan of the currency system in SA, look at US currency for example.  we've got pennies, nickels, dimes, quarters, $1 bills, $5 bills, $10 bills, $20 bills, $50, and $100.  So, that's 10 different denominations (no one uses $2 bills, or dollar coins), the difference between a penny and a hundred dollar bill is x10000.  In SA we've got 27 or 30 different denominations, and the difference between emerald broams and diamond chips is only x1000.  It seems to work fine, but it's pretty cluttered.
Looking at the quote saying that Shallan used all nine colors of sphere, I think she means actual color, I don't think she counts white in that, so that would be nine colors plus white, and so we're back to ten types.  This really makes the most sense.  I mean, why wouldn't they use all ten types of gem as currency?  Why exclude one?
It might have something to do with Talenel.
I don't think the Heralds advertised after that last Desolation that they'd left one of their own to an endless cycle of torture.  Besides the readers, I think only the other Heralds, Hoid, and maybe a few others knew about Taln.

Terez

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2010, 06:35:08 AM »
I don't think the Heralds advertised after that last Desolation that they'd left one of their own to an endless cycle of torture.  Besides the readers, I think only the other Heralds, Hoid, and maybe a few others knew about Taln.

I wonder why he is called the 'bearer of all agonies', if no one knows or even has a clue. It could have been suppressed during the Hierocracy, but I'm guessing the Radiants probably had a clue, and that the Heralds' desertion had something to do with the Recreance (though I think the human condition likely had something to do with it as well).

Cheese Ninja

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2010, 08:35:27 AM »
I did not notice that Talenelat was called that.  Found it in the book after looking just now.  Maybe people do know then?  Or perhaps they only know part of his story.

I was thinking of the bookseller again, with the conversion rate we're guessing at right now, 2 emeralds 3 sapphires, could also be expressed 3 emeralds 1 sapphire 4 garnet or (3.875 emeralds)

Salkara

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2010, 07:29:39 PM »
I forget where it say this, but somewhere it states that the value for the gems is based on Soulcasting properties. The part that gets me is one character (I think Shallan) thinks about how diamonds are one of lowest value gems due to their lack of use in Soulcasting. That just kind of stuck with me because it's the opposite of real life.

Fireborn

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2010, 05:09:53 AM »
Quote from: Cheese Ninja
no one uses $2 bills
My uncle sends me a $2 bill in his card every birthday. XP

Quote from: Terez
I wonder why he is called the 'bearer of all agonies'
Can we get a page reference on that?  I don't recall that at all and I'm fairly good at picking up stuff like that. (fairly, not perfect, I could've missed it)

Quote from: 11thorderknight
when Shallan thinks about 9 colors of gems, i'm sure she includes diamonds. But, garnet and ruby might be considered to be the same color. Also, we don't know what color the zircons in this system are (real zircons have lots of colors).
Good point, I forgot about that.

When to live is to die, and to die is to live, does either really matter?

Terez

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #28 on: October 03, 2010, 05:13:12 AM »
It's in chapter 6.

ehyde

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Re: The value of spheres in WoK (no spoilers)
« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2010, 08:10:58 AM »
If you can think of it, somewhere on the internet there's a website for it.

Glow-in-the-dark marbles seems like an easy one.

If you use a black light, then Vaseline Uranium marbles glow in the dark...plenty of them on sale on Ebay.  Not too expensive, either, but they just glow...they don't have a color chip in the middle, and I'd expect the chips would glow the color of their gemstone.

Man, in cosplay you gotta work with what you can work with. One of the coolest things I saw at Dragon were the Mistborn with the vials of metal suspended in alcohol... sure, it was all Goldshläger, but that's not quite the point. It was little bits of gold you could drink.

Someone comes up at the next Con with a pouch full of glowing spheres, and the last thing I'm likely to say is, "nice, but they really ought to glow different colors, and only in the little gems in the center, and aren't these a bit too large or small?"

Hell no! Glowy spheres! Kick-ass!

I like the idea of using a tiny black-light at the bottom of the pouch, but do they make tiny little LED UV lights? 'Cause I figured that's what you'd need to use, something small but powerful that can be placed at the bottom to shine up and through. Of course, they effect will be lost if you take the spheres out...



Yup: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3107633

Hmm ... my sister is taking a glass-working class, I think I need to discuss a few things with her :-)