Poll

Which author is the most overated in the genre?

J.K. Rowling
J. R. R. Tolkien (choose this and Gollum will eat you)
Robert Jordan (LIES!!!)
Terry Goodkind
Orson Scott Card
Terry Brooks

Author Topic: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly  (Read 13593 times)

Bejay

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2009, 08:47:30 PM »
Well, I voted for PURE CUTENESS because, first of all, I like PONIES better and what really decided me is that PONIES does not try to convey his rather radical conservative values to me. I loved the first couple of PURE CUTENESS' books, but when he changed to writing "death penalty/communism is evil" vouchers.

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2009, 05:15:15 AM »
sortitus-- I my hate of Goodkind steams from a loss of 8 dollars, one day of my life, and pretty much every interview of him I've ever read(read one, and come join us in our loathing).

Andrew the Great

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2009, 07:10:44 AM »
Yeah, he's pretty much an arrogant jerk, and he thinks it's cool to insult his fans.

That, and he insists that he's not a fantasy author, because fantasy books simply can't be good, right? And his books, of course, are (good, not fantasy).

Between his attitudes toward the fantasy genre and his attitudes toward people in general, I've never been able to make myself like Goodkind. Add to that the fact that his books (with the exception of Wizard's First Rule) kind of suck.... Yeah, I'm not a Goodkind fan.
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firstRainbowRose

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2009, 07:36:43 AM »
I'd like to nominate the dude who wrote Eragon.  I will give my disclaimer and state that while I tried to read the book it was just too badly done for me and I couldn't get into it.  However, I've heard from tons of people who have read it that the book (or, rather, all his books) are one gigantic fanfic.  He pulled this characteristic for X people from Y book, and another thing from another and mashed them all together.  So, if anyone is undeserving it's him since all he did was took already published ideas and threw them together into the same universe.
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2009, 08:03:52 AM »
I don't understand your complaint. I mean, it is one thing to say that you found the book unengaging, but most authors have works that have inspired them that they build from. I personally can't think of an author/book that I would call wholely original in resent years and am willing to bet the books I thought were original when I was young, I simply didn't know the source. And then who knows if I would like an 'original' book if I found it? I guess I don't personally care for hearing whether or not a book is 'cliché' and would rather hear if the author executed it well, which is all very subjective. It makes the question of 'whether or not the author deserves their fame' rather difficult. After all, they are famous for a reason (somebody liked them) so they obviously have done something right that aspiring authors (like myself) could potentially learn from.  :)
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firstRainbowRose

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2009, 08:12:44 AM »
Well, I do agree with you there.  I remember a drama class where the teacher told us to create a new villian.  By the end of class she pointed out that all of us had used ~something~ to start out our villian (swords, random lines, etc), and that we have to draw from ourselves in order to act.  We do have to learn from others.

My point is I was at a party (I think it might have even been one of the rifftrax parties) and a couple of the people there were talking about the third book, and I remember the conversation going something like this:

person 1: He has the elves talk like in the same style as the elves from X book (I don't remember the original source book.)
person 2: I remember.  It was annoying enough to read and try to understand the style in the original book.  This rip off was even more annoying.

That's paraphrased a bit, but that was the gist of the conversation.  And I've heard a couple of people make that same comment.  So it sound like (and if anyone has read the books and can confirm/debunk this, I will bow to you) really he has litrally taken the things and meshed them together.  (IE - Let's take a dragon from pern, only make it so that you don't have to impress it,  and have a young hidden king find and befriend the dragon.  Oh, and he'll be watched over by a comination of the guy from Earthsea and a couple of Lord of the rings characters.)
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Bejay

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2009, 11:35:52 AM »
You might have to consider that Eragon was written by a 15 year old, who had never been to a public school (home taught by his parents I think) and had only his fantasy stories to get "out".  The book is ok, a light read, but there is no polish. Not great, but then, not terrybad. :)

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #22 on: October 12, 2009, 02:30:41 PM »
I personally thought Eragon was pretty decent. Yes, unorginal, but since it was written by a 15 year old, I'm willing to put that aside. It was an entertaining read. The other two however. You'd think he'd get better as he got older. You'd think he'd get more original. But no. No, he doesn't. If anything, he gets worse. That's saying something...
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #23 on: October 12, 2009, 07:11:38 PM »
Yeah, I liked the first one okay, and got through the second, but I couldn't get through the third. Even my sister (that loved Eragon and claimed that it was a much better read than the longer, more involved fantasy I have attempted to give her) couldn't get through the third one. Maybe he is used to self publishing where he doesn't have to listen to an editor?

In other news, I just read an interview by Terry Goodkind. Wow. There really is no other words to describe.... :P
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2009, 08:27:06 PM »
I don't know, I liked the third better than the second. Granted, it's still not as good as the first (which is saying something).

And aren't Goodkind interviews so much fun? They just make you feel warm and fuzzy inside!
« Last Edit: October 16, 2009, 11:43:23 PM by Andrew the Great »
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2009, 07:37:54 PM »
This topic compelled me to read a Terry Goodkind interview. I've never read any Sword of Truth, but that interview pretty much confirmed the Goodkind-bashing that goes on around here. He deserves it.

As for Eragon, well, it was good when I was a freshman in high school. It really motivated me (at the time) that a teenager could write, and it's not just an unattainable goal. That was a wonderful thing. Brisingr, however, was a piece of crap. I finished the novel, but still... not a fun experience. Turd, 100%. The books get worse and worse.
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2009, 05:13:31 AM »
Dragon riders and Vampires have been ridden into the ground...
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #27 on: October 18, 2009, 06:38:15 AM »
I broke down and did some research. Without reading any of Goodkind's stories, the tale I see is this:

Goodkind's first book was entertaining, but very derivative. He denies that his books are derivative (or fantasy) because of his obsession with Objectivism. He believes that all fantasy is super-derivative of Tolkien, world or magic centric (Goodkind says that his books are plot-centric), and poorly written. Except for his.

All of his books read similarly, so don't bother with more than one (sounds like a Terry ;)). Expect his characters to lecture often, do stupid things (remember, plot is the focus, not character), and conform to stereotypes.

My take is that he (as he claims) doesn't read fantasy, and so is unaware of the developments that the genre has been making. He truly thinks that what he's writing is original, but he is too lazy to see if his ideas have been done before. Goodkind is what you get when you lock someone in a room for twenty years with nothing but food, drink, writing tools, and literature from Rand and Tolkien. They may insist that their work, despite any similarities it holds to their contemporaries, is completely original because the process used was different. Which is obviously rather silly. If you make your lemonade by throwing lemons at the wall above a pitcher full of water, it's still lemonade. It might be a little bitter, but it's still lemonade.

What I'm saying is that maybe Goodkind threw Fellowship of the Ring against the wall above a pitcher full of shredded Atlas Shrugged enough times that all of the words mixed together into a passable novel. It sold, so if the system ain't broke, don't fix it! *throws RotK against the wall above a pitcher full of The Fountainhead*
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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #28 on: October 18, 2009, 11:10:46 AM »
The interview I read from him said, "I can't remember the last time I read a novel." Okay, so he's dyslexic, but come on... Don't claim your stuff is original when all you have is the belief that it is.

Because wow, if that were the case, I could totally sell my first book. Plenty of me believing it was original in there!
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Bookstore Guy

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Re: Authors undeserving of their fame.....possibly
« Reply #29 on: October 19, 2009, 06:07:22 PM »
I broke down and did some research. Without reading any of Goodkind's stories, the tale I see is this:

Goodkind's first book was entertaining, but very derivative. He denies that his books are derivative (or fantasy) because of his obsession with Objectivism. He believes that all fantasy is super-derivative of Tolkien, world or magic centric (Goodkind says that his books are plot-centric), and poorly written. Except for his.

All of his books read similarly, so don't bother with more than one (sounds like a Terry ;)). Expect his characters to lecture often, do stupid things (remember, plot is the focus, not character), and conform to stereotypes.

My take is that he (as he claims) doesn't read fantasy, and so is unaware of the developments that the genre has been making. He truly thinks that what he's writing is original, but he is too lazy to see if his ideas have been done before. Goodkind is what you get when you lock someone in a room for twenty years with nothing but food, drink, writing tools, and literature from Rand and Tolkien. They may insist that their work, despite any similarities it holds to their contemporaries, is completely original because the process used was different. Which is obviously rather silly. If you make your lemonade by throwing lemons at the wall above a pitcher full of water, it's still lemonade. It might be a little bitter, but it's still lemonade.

What I'm saying is that maybe Goodkind threw Fellowship of the Ring against the wall above a pitcher full of shredded Atlas Shrugged enough times that all of the words mixed together into a passable novel. It sold, so if the system ain't broke, don't fix it! *throws RotK against the wall above a pitcher full of The Fountainhead*

Good summary. I approve.

The interview I read from him said, "I can't remember the last time I read a novel." Okay, so he's dyslexic, but come on... Don't claim your stuff is original when all you have is the belief that it is.

Because wow, if that were the case, I could totally sell my first book. Plenty of me believing it was original in there!

This is my main problem. It's like a writing group I went to, and I asked "So what does everyone read and get their influences from?" And people said they only read Dragonlance, or one guy said he hadn't read a novel in years--just books on writing. Understand the genre people. Understand the genre.
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