3 August - Concord - Chs 5 and 6

[Flo_the_G]

As always, thanks for reading, commenting, etc.

[Silk]

Well. I was really hoping not to be the first to reply, because I really don't have much to say about this submission. "Good, now keep going" does not a useful critique make. Ah well. Someone else want to jump in and do my thinking for me, please?

I can't even do much nitpicking...

"It was a feeling you couldn't really describe to someone who hadn't experienced it themselves." This might just be a personal thing, but I always grimace a bit when I see lines like this in fiction. I don't know, it just feels like a bit of a cheat.

I did feel a bit at the very start of the submission that I was starting to lose my handle on what's happening/who's being introduced, but honestly I think that has a lot more to do with the choppy way we're receiving your submissions than anything you're doing. In thinking about it, we haven't really been introduced to that many people.

So yeah, that's really... it. Sorry I didn't have much useful to say. :/

[Flo_the_G]

"It was a feeling you couldn't really describe to someone who hadn't experienced it themselves." This might just be a personal thing, but I always grimace a bit when I see lines like this in fiction. I don't know, it just feels like a bit of a cheat.

It seemed like that to me too, to be honest. I think it's also too much of a direct adress to the reader, breaking the fourth wall, if you will.

As to the introduction of new people, I think I'll give Spencer a bit more face time in von Bredow's first chapter, just in case.

[Silk]

Well, breaking the fourth wall isn't always a bad thing...

[RavenstarRHJF]

Hey Flo, sorry I'm late.  Really. busy. week.

Starting off, I couldn't remember if we'd seen Spencer before, but that might just be the "writing group problem" of never having the whole story in front of you at any one time.

Lots a great characterizations, nice action, and your world is really starting to come together.

A few things:
Rubber bullets- it's not clear whether they're the only thing in his cartridge, if he has multiple ordnance options with his weapon, or whether they are simply standard ship-board issue (to avoid perforating the hull).

When Juno was interrogating the Imperial in chapter three, she had to close her eyes and really concentrate to make contact with him, and it took a lot out of her.  But she seems a lot more proficient here- is that lack of subtlety (force instead of persuasion) or is it adrenaline?  Doesn't need to be explained here (not her POV after all), but I'd like to see it somewhere along the line.

"Sitrep."- this is obviously military slang, and that's fine, but it'd help if you explained the term right after you used it.

Von Bredow seems like much less of a jerk right now, but he may just be hiding behind protocol.

It seems a little odd that setting up jumps is as quick and smooth as you've just presented it.  They don't even seem worried about the incoming missiles.  Did Starfire fire them at extreme range?

It seems very odd that they wouldn't have some kind of built-in equipment to allow anchoring to the floor when the gravity goes...

The section where you describe the feeling of jumping- it would flow better if you told us what Von Bredow was feeling first- right after telling us he hated jumping- and then explained it.

All in all, great submission! 

[Flo_the_G]

Starting off, I couldn't remember if we'd seen Spencer before, but that might just be the "writing group problem" of never having the whole story in front of you at any one time.

Only very briefly. I'll be expanding that bit.

Rubber bullets- it's not clear whether they're the only thing in his cartridge, if he has multiple ordnance options with his weapon, or whether they are simply standard ship-board issue (to avoid perforating the hull).

Multiple options hadn't really occurred to me, I find the whole concept quite cheesy, actually. Multiple types of ammo are usually referenced right before someone pulls out their plasma bullets, or something equally silly.

On the other hand, maybe I've simply read the wrong books. ^^

When Juno was interrogating the Imperial in chapter three, she had to close her eyes and really concentrate to make contact with him, and it took a lot out of her.  But she seems a lot more proficient here- is that lack of subtlety (force instead of persuasion) or is it adrenaline?  Doesn't need to be explained here (not her POV after all), but I'd like to see it somewhere along the line.

Juno gets the next chapter, but I don't think I've explained the previous scene in that at all. Yet.

"Sitrep."- this is obviously military slang, and that's fine, but it'd help if you explained the term right after you used it.

I had hoped it would be apparent from the context, or, even better, that the reader would already know what it means. My explanations of these things tend to feel somewhat clumsy, so I always try to leave them out.

It seems a little odd that setting up jumps is as quick and smooth as you've just presented it.  They don't even seem worried about the incoming missiles.  Did Starfire fire them at extreme range?

Yes, they fired at rather long range. Also, I apparently forgot to show some people being worried.

It seems very odd that they wouldn't have some kind of built-in equipment to allow anchoring to the floor when the gravity goes...

Does it? Another thing that hadn't occurred to me. That's what the handrails on the ceilings were supposed to be for, but I guess I didn't really mention that. Bugger.

The section where you describe the feeling of jumping- it would flow better if you told us what Von Bredow was feeling first- right after telling us he hated jumping- and then explained it.

Sounds like it would work, I'll try that.

Thanks once again for commenting, both of you.

Right, back to universitarian drudgery...

[RavenstarRHJF]

Multiple options hadn't really occurred to me, I find the whole concept quite cheesy, actually. Multiple types of ammo are usually referenced right before someone pulls out their plasma bullets, or something equally silly.

On the other hand, maybe I've simply read the wrong books. ^^

Well, my beef with the rubber bullets isn't that they're rubber, it's this line:

he had also hit the pistol-brandishing maniac of a woman with at the very least one of his non-lethal rubber bullets

Makes it sound like he'd been firing several different types of ammo. 

If it's going to be standard ship-board issue to carry non-lethal bullets, then we should learn about that before the shooting actually starts.  You could even have Spencer make a smug internal remark about her not knowing the bullets in the gun are rubber.  Or you need to make a previous distinction between his gun and the ones the midshipmen/marines are wearing/carrying.

"Sitrep" is somewhat intuitive within the context, but it's also not readily translatable.  I get that it's military slang for "What's the situation" (sit-) but I'm not getting what the -rep part is referring to.  It's trivial, but little things like that bug me.

Yes, they fired at rather long range. Also, I apparently forgot to show some people being worried.

I went back and read it again, and you do have some of them getting nervous as the missiles get nearer.  It'd make it more clear why the brass isn't concerned, though, if Von Bredow commented on the fact that it's extremely long range and therefore foolish.

It seems very odd that they wouldn't have some kind of built-in equipment to allow anchoring to the floor when the gravity goes...

Does it? Another thing that hadn't occurred to me. That's what the handrails on the ceilings were supposed to be for, but I guess I didn't really mention that. Bugger.

Either your ships have very low ceilings, or people don't mind falling a few feet after each jump.
Here's my thought process on this: if their artificial gravity was spotty or otherwise unreliable, it would make sense to have handholds on the ceiling, and everyone would be used to the sensation of constant freefall.  However, it seems like that's not the case here.  Since it's only a few seconds of weightlessness before and after each jump, it seems silly not to have sticky patches or boot latches on the floor at predictable intervals in case someone's caught out in a hallway right before a jump.  I also imagine that people would prefer to remain anchored to the floor even if it doesn't feel like it's the "floor" anymore.
Eh, it's your story, and I don't consider myself particularly good at figuring out what's feasible and what's not in "hard" sci-fi.  Just my two cents.

[Flo_the_G]

it's this line:

Ah. The stress is supposed to go on "one" there. Shouldn't be a problem to reword that to make it clearer. I'll definitely mention the whole ammo deal in more detail in the next draft.

The -rep part stands for report. Maybe I should add a glossary. Or I could try to remember now and then that not everyone is as great a geek as I am.

I'll go back and add a few more references to the ceiling issue in the earlier chapters. They are supposed to be pretty low, the entire ship being somewhat more akin to a modern-day submarine than a surface ship. Or maybe to a not-quite-so modern submarine. The newer ones appear to be quite large.^^

The idea is that they'll be either strapped into their seats, or they'll grab the handrails, which would enable them to remain pretty much wherever they are when gravity goes bye-bye. They would only have to exert the slightest amount of force downwards to keep their feet touching the floor, after all.

[ErikHolmes]

Good submission. So good in fact that I don't have a lot to add either.

But to add to the comments on gravity:  I'd come up with something interesting and unique. Theres probably a million ideas online about how to anchor oneself to the floor when theres no gravity.

Maybe every few feet on the floor is a pad, then when stepped on a certain way locks onto the shoe. Or you could even go with something like magnetic boots, etc.

I'm sure they'd have something, even if its only a zipline with a clip to connect to something nearby.

Rubber bullets:

IMO it seems like the military always hates using things like this. If they are going to shoot someone, they shoot to kill. If you're worrying about the bullets going through the hull, they have special ammo made to not do something like that. They use them on Jets.

Also, currently the military has a weapon called the LRAD (Long Range Acoustic Device). It basically shoots a beam of very loud sound. It will stop someone. You drop what you have in your hands and cover your ears. Its as effective as handcuffs. Simple firing the weapon at an output where the eardrums are ruptured and the person incapacitated is also an option.

Maybe your men have access to SRAD weapons (Short Range Acoustic Devices). Then again, that might be bad for your telepath.

I also have to agree that she seemed to go from Padawan to Jedi with her telepathy pretty quickly.

Great submission though!

[Flo_the_G]

Thanks.

On the subject of gravity and the lack thereof: I was thinking mainly of cost efficiency and system reliability. Sure, you can issue magnetic boots to every member of the crew, or you can have pads that lock your boots to the ground, or whatever. But those would be pretty expensive. If the brass have to choose between magnetic boots and more guns, I think they'll always go for the guns. Then there's the reliability issue. The more complex the system gets (i.e. anything using electricity), the more likely it is to fail. So sticking a few rails on the walls and ceilings seemed like the most feasible option to me. If gravity's out for a few seconds, holding on to a rail is easier than switching on magnetic boots. If it's out for longer than that, navigating the corridors in weightlessness should be quicker using the handrails than using those clumsy boots (and would be impossible using pads that lock your feet to the ground or anything similar). Also, there aren't any magnetic boots on ISS.

As for the bullets, I'm actually worrying about the bullets going through characters that will be relevant for the plot later on.

I've read a lot about all these strange new non-lethal weapons, but I think they all have one main drawback, namely that they're a seperate weapons system. For rubber bullets you only have to switch mags (i.e. carry a second mag), whereas one of these other things would have to be taken along beside your actual main weapon.

Having them would make sense for police forces, but not necessarily the military, I think.

You'd probably also have too much collateral damage once you increased the output to eardrum-rupturing levels, at least if there's a hostage standing right next to your target.

Trust me, I've obsessed over the technological issues quite a bit. But I appreciate suggestions such as these, there's always the possibility I overlooked something, or based some aspect or other on an idiotic assumption.


I think I know what the issue with the Padawan to Jedi-evolution is, though. She didn't actually get the info about the gun from Spencer, she got it from the midshipman. Only you wouldn't know that, because all the evidence in the text seems to point towards Spencer. I'll be fixing that... 

[Silk]

As for the bullets, I'm actually worrying about the bullets going through characters that will be relevant for the plot later on.

Laughing hysterically.

That is all.

[Flo_the_G]

Laughing hysterically.

My work here is done.

[ErikHolmes]

On the subject of gravity and the lack thereof: I was thinking mainly of cost efficiency and system reliability.

I'd think clips and ziplines then. The main concern will be for safety. Especially when off world where replacement personnel isn't available.

I've read a lot about all these strange new non-lethal weapons, but I think they all have one main drawback, namely that they're a seperate weapons system. For rubber bullets you only have to switch mags (i.e. carry a second mag), whereas one of these other things would have to be taken along beside your actual main weapon.

Having them would make sense for police forces, but not necessarily the military, I think.

The LRAD's are already in use by the military. Not the police. They are pretty effective. But I can see your point as well. Still, they are really really nice for dealing with civilians and unarmed opponents. There probably isn't anything better.

They also have these new flashlights with a strobe effect that stuns opponents like the LED Incapacitator with high-intensity LEDs, pulsating at varying rates, which make the target temporarily blind and dizzy.

[Flo_the_G]

I'd think clips and ziplines then. The main concern will be for safety. Especially when off world where replacement personnel isn't available.

But why? To go back to present-day examples, the people on the ISS don't go about their everyday work secured by ziplines, right? So I'd assume that zero-G apparently isn't that much of a safety risk. Or am I missing something?

I didn't know LRAD's were actually in use already, I thought they were still more or less in development. On the other hand, it's probably been two years since last I checked. I'll have to look into all the new futuristic weaponry again, I guess. Sounds like my kind of fun.

[ErikHolmes]

But why? To go back to present-day examples, the people on the ISS don't go about their everyday work secured by ziplines, right? So I'd assume that zero-G apparently isn't that much of a safety risk. Or am I missing something?

I'm thinking mainly because in the ISS gravity doesn't come and go.

Imagine:

The ship jumps. During the jump, you get sick. As you're holding your stomach, weightless, you float a few feet into the air.

Then the gravity comes back on.

Medic!   

I didn't know LRAD's were actually in use already, I thought they were still more or less in development. On the other hand, it's probably been two years since last I checked. I'll have to look into all the new futuristic weaponry again, I guess. Sounds like my kind of fun.

Actually, looks like the NYC Police have been using them since 2004 and they are already a lot smaller then I thought. (About the same size as a megaphone).