The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread

[Reaves]

This thought is unrelated, but I was wondering what would happen if you reused an Inquisitor's hemalurgical spike. All the evidence says you probably can reuse it; the koloss have been reusing theirs and TenSoon took OreSeurs spike.

But basically, lets say the Inquisitor was a Seeker to start out with, then got a spike taken from another Seeker, in addition to his others.
If someone managed to kill said Inquisitor and then take that spike, would that person get the abilities of the spike plus the abilities that the Inquisitor had to start out with? Or just the abilities of the spike?

[GoryCat]

I don't have my HoA copy here, but I am fairly certain that there is a different metal spike which grants Feruchemical Physical abilities (like speed) and Feruchemical Mental Abilities (like health).

Yes; Gold does physical, Brass does mental.  Somehow health doesn't seem like a mental ability; the Inquisitors sure don't have much mental health.

[douglas]

No, it's Pewter that steals Feruchemical Physical abilities.  Considering that Brandon strives for consistency and logic in his magic systems, I think gold's health should actually be a Feruchemical Temporal ability (affects time required to heal and gold is a Temporal metal for Allomancy), but the chart doesn't list a known ability to steal Feruchemical Temporal powers and I'd think it would be there since Feruchemical Health is (I think) a standard Inquisitor ability.

[Chaos]

This thought is unrelated, but I was wondering what would happen if you reused an Inquisitor's hemalurgical spike. All the evidence says you probably can reuse it; the koloss have been reusing theirs and TenSoon took OreSeurs spike.

But basically, lets say the Inquisitor was a Seeker to start out with, then got a spike taken from another Seeker, in addition to his others.
If someone managed to kill said Inquisitor and then take that spike, would that person get the abilities of the spike plus the abilities that the Inquisitor had to start out with? Or just the abilities of the spike?

I would think just the abilities of the spike. Though, that largely depends where said spike is placed.

No, it's Pewter that steals Feruchemical Physical abilities.  Considering that Brandon strives for consistency and logic in his magic systems, I think gold's health should actually be a Feruchemical Temporal ability (affects time required to heal and gold is a Temporal metal for Allomancy), but the chart doesn't list a known ability to steal Feruchemical Temporal powers and I'd think it would be there since Feruchemical Health is (I think) a standard Inquisitor ability.

Now I'm really just sad I don't have my Hero of Ages copy with me, because I did an analysis of the Hemalurgical powers. I didn't find out much, but I did find out this:

For every quartet of metals, there is one metal which steals Allomantic attributes in that quartet and one that steals Feruchemical attributes in that quartet (it's important to remember that with Feruchemy, things don't make as much sense, I think. I believe "warmness" is under the Mental metals, which is not as intuitive as Allomancy's organization). The other two Hemalurgical metals in said quartet steal non-Metallic properties.

[Comatose]

My copy is at school.  I was pretty sure gold would be physical.
Does the inquisitor even have a brass spike?  I thought they were just bronze, steel, and pewter.
Also there was no atium spike, was he unable to burn the temporal metals?

[Chaos]

Gold is not physical, it's temporal. From what I remember, Atium stole Allomantic Temporal properties, and therefore Gold steals Feruchemical Temporal properties. Being in the Temporal quartet, it must be as such.

[little wilson]

Using the back of HoA, this is what I've got:

Allomantic Physical Metals

Iron:
Feruchemy stores Physical Weight
Hemalurgy steals Human Strength

Steel:
Feruchemy stores Physical Speed
Hemalurgy steals Allomantic Physical Powers

Tin:
Feruchemy stores Physical Senses
Hemalurgy steals Human Senses

Pewter:
Feruchemy stores Physical Strength
Hemalurgy steals Feruchemical Physical Powers


Allomantic Mental Metals

Brass:
Feruchemy stores Warmth
Hemalurgy steals Feruchemical Mental Attributes

Zinc:
Feruchemy stores Mental Speed
Hemalurgy steals Human Emotional Fortitude

Copper:
Feruchemy stores Memories
Hemalurgy steals Human Mental Fortitude

Bronze:
Feruchemy stores Wakefulness
Hemalurgy steals Allomantic Mental Powers


Allomantic Enhancement Metals

Aluminum:
Feruchemy is unknown,
Hemalurgy steals Allomantic Enhancement Powers

Duralumin:
both unknown


Allomantic Temporal Metals (kind of)

Atium:
Feruchemy stores Age
Hemalurgy steals Allomantic Temporal Powers

Malatium:
both unknown

Gold:
Feruchemy stores Health
Hemalurgy is unknown

Electrum:
both unknown


Based on this, Feruchemy can be split into two groups: Physical Powers and Mental Attributes. I see nothing about Feruchuemical Temporal...unless it's one of the Feruchemy or Hemalurgy unknowns.

Hope this helps for those of you without your copies of HoA....

[Chaos]

That's extremely helpful, wilson. Thanks!

I would still say that the two Hemalurgical powers still missing are Feruchemical Temporal Powers and Feruchemical Enhancement powers. It seems like a logical extrapolation.

Two things I would note about the chart:

On the Physical and Mental metals, the metals which steal Allomantic or Feruchemical powers are the alloys. For Temporal and Enhancement, this is not true (though, with atium not actually being a real metal on the chart, I'm sure some things would fall into place better).

Also interesting is trying to predict which metal will have the Allomantic stealing for the quartet or the Feruchemical for the quartet (since these two are present in every quartet of metals). It's quite a difficult feat. I will still classify metals with the typical Allomantic External/Internal and Pushing/Pulling for convenience. It appears that a Hemalurgical power (say, Allomantic stealing) is not officially designated to a particular metal in a quartet. For example, Steel (External Pushing) steals Allomantic Powers, but Bronze (Internal Pushing) steals Allomantic Powers for the mental metals. There appears to be no correlation there.

Not to mention the weird stuff happening on the second half of the chart, with Aluminum, as a base metal (and therefore pulling) getting an Allomantic stealing attribute. Grah.

[GreenMonsta]

I miss this thread. . . .   So many good times.

[hoid354]

I am glad you started this thread.  Let's get rolling.  I was reading MB2 Chapter 27's annotation and EUOL mentions that Zane cutting himself quiets the voice in his head, and this has something to do with the properties of Hemalurgy.  Of course, he then basically RAFO's us, but the connection to blood and Hemalurgy is again shown.

Another Hemalurgy possibility is, of course, Vin's earring.  Her mother kills her sister then jabs the earring into Vin's ear.  She also pushes away the mists at the end of MB2, and can't draw on the mists again like she did at the end of MB1, when her earring was pushed out by TLR.  Pretty good evidence, I'd say.

In addition to Chaos' points on Steel Inquisitors, I would also add that they seem to possess additional powers beyond that of a Mistborn, like incredible healing powers, and the ability to "see" the blue lines from even the smallest amounts of metal, so much so that they can see things in great detail purely through Allomancy.

Finally, should we spend any time discussing how the SI's feel pain from the spikes based on their emotions?  Marsh and the lead Inky (Kar?), mention the pain briefly at different times.    That's all I have for now.

wow, you really called that early on... didnt even think about that ( i forgot vin's mother killed her sister with the earring)

[little wilson]

I would still say that the two Hemalurgical powers still missing are Feruchemical Temporal Powers and Feruchemical Enhancement powers. It seems like a logical extrapolation.

That actually works. I didn't really study it when I was writing it out, but it's a Physical Metal that gives Hemalurgy the power to steal both Feruchemical Physical and Allomantic Physical. Same with Mental for Feruchemy and Allomancy. With Temporal, Electrum isn't known, nor is Cadmium and Cerrobend....And the Hemalurgical Feruchemical Enhancement stealer could be Duralumin, or it could be Nicrosil or Chromium....

The question I have is this: Since we know that Allomancy separates into the four categories, is that separation the same for Feruchemy? Obviously the storing for the metals in the A. Phys. Metals are F. Phys. But can the same be said of the storing for the A. Mental Metals? Are Warmth and Wakefulness F. Mental Attributes? And is Health a F. Temporal Attribute? It would make sense....

I'll have to look it over some more to figure out the logic of the rest of it...Which may be hard since Nicrosil, Chromium, Cadmium, and Cerrobend aren't even on there....And Atium and Malatium are...Oh well. I'll work with it....But first I need to write. I'm gonna try to pull a mini Raethe-day tomorrow (writing 25k in one day....but I'm only going for about...10k. Maybe....). And then I'll look over this....

[Chaos]

That actually works. I didn't really study it when I was writing it out, but it's a Physical Metal that gives Hemalurgy the power to steal both Feruchemical Physical and Allomantic Physical. Same with Mental for Feruchemy and Allomancy. With Temporal, Electrum isn't known, nor is Cadmium and Cerrobend....And the Hemalurgical Feruchemical Enhancement stealer could be Duralumin, or it could be Nicrosil or Chromium....

The question I have is this: Since we know that Allomancy separates into the four categories, is that separation the same for Feruchemy? Obviously the storing for the metals in the A. Phys. Metals are F. Phys. But can the same be said of the storing for the A. Mental Metals? Are Warmth and Wakefulness F. Mental Attributes? And is Health a F. Temporal Attribute? It would make sense....

The Hemalurgical Feruchemical Enhancement metal cannot be duralumin. Looking at the eight base metals, each pair of metals have one Metallic attribute (either Allomantic or Feruchemical) and one other trait. Never does a pair have both Allomantic and Feruchemical stealing in it. So it is safe to assume that the Feruchemical Enhancement metal is either Chromium or Nicrosil.

I would think that the divisions are the same for all three Metallic Arts, because it would kind of just be needlessly complicated any other way.

[Andrew the Great]

I just have one question. At the beginning of book 3, Vin and Elend fought an Inquisitor with a hemalurgical spike that gave him the feruchemial power of speed. That power is stored in steel, and hemalurgy apparently steals allomancy from steel. So where'd the speed come from?

I miss this thread too, Green.

[Chaos]

I don't remember that they explicitly mentioned what kind of spike it was.

[little wilson]

He probably had a steel spike in him, but I think he must've had a Pewter spike, too. Pewter as a Hemalurgical spike would give the Inquisitor Feruchemical Physical powers, and speed is a physical power, and since it's stored as a F. Phys., that would mean a pewter spike...I think.