The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread

[Andrew the Great]

Wow, lots of activity around here! That's what I get for not posting for a few days...

I agree, the brass spike and a feruchemial sacrifice doesn't make much sense. So why use a feruchemist? Because you have him. I don't think the sacrifice needs to have any specific powers. The inquisitors just had the feruchemist around because they had been questioning him. Then, when they were done, they used him as a sacrifice.

And I still think that the significance of the spike through the sacrifice's heart is that all of the spikes must go through the sacrifice's heart. Meaning you would need several sacrifices. And I don't think it has to go into the inquisitor's heart, either, just into his chest.

[Comatose]

Or his eyes.

Quote from Phaz

Based on the "hemalurgy is stealing power" theory I think feruchemists make lots of sense.   If using (Skaa) alomancers steals the alomancy power, then it makes sense that using feruchmests would mean that it steals their power and gives it to the inquisitor.  That would make some pretty bad ass inquisitors.

But the  sacrifice per power per spike doesn't work here, since they were using a BRASS spike, which in feruchmey stores warmth, what would the inquisitors need with that power, why waste a valuable feruchmist sacrifice on warmth, when there are other more potent powers, like strength or speed, or healing.
Eventhought they captured the entire Synod, if they need multiple sacrifices per inquisitor, they're not going to get many new inquisitors if they make a sacrifice for every feruchemical power, remember, Feruchemists are very rare because of the breeding programs.  I don't think the spike per power theory applies.

[JCHancey]

What if the Hemalurgic property of brass is completely different from both Allomancy's and Feruchemy's use of it? They have some of the same powers of Allomancer but also Feruchemy, or it appears that way. Brass is warmth for Feruchemy and Rioting for Allomancy. Is it too far out to say that Hemalurgy uses it differently?

[Reaves]

What if the Hemalurgic property of brass is completely different from both Allomancy's and Feruchemy's use of it? They have some of the same powers of Allomancer but also Feruchemy, or it appears that way. Brass is warmth for Feruchemy and Rioting for Allomancy. Is it too far out to say that Hemalurgy uses it differently?

i would find it highly unusual if it wasn't different. I suspect the three systems have some metals in common, such as pewter for strength and tin for things such as eyesight or hearing, but i would assume they are all equally symmetrical in most things.

[Comatose]

If the powers don't change no matter who the sacrifice though, then why go throught the effort to use feruchemists, why not jsut use all teh slaves they have lying around at the conventicle?

[SarahG]

If the powers don't change no matter who the sacrifice though, then why go throught the effort to use feruchemists, why not jsut use all teh slaves they have lying around at the conventicle?

They probably did use those slaves, already - weren't they discovered brutally slaughtered?  I'm not sure, I don't have my copy with me.

In any event, I agree that there's some significance to using a feruchemist (beyond that just being who they had available) though I don't know what that significance might be.

[Comatose]

The were slaughtered but not in the way that they were sacrificed, remember,Kelsier remarks in book one when they come to the scene where Marsh was "created" that it was messy, even for the inquisitors.  Sazed pays very close attention to detail, if the slaves had been used as sacrifices, there would have been hints, not just: they were slaughtered or even, they were horribly slaughtered.

[Qarlin]

So, knowing that I don't know what the different metals mean, what if the spike goes through the heart of the sacrifice, effectively taking their life energy and giving it to the inquisitor. Mistings are mistings and not mistborn because they don't have enough power, or enough of the right kind of blood, as it were.

So by taking the life energy from someone else, they increase in power from a misting to an allomancer, and then to have such power that they can simulate drawing on the mists, even though they can't; they're using the extra life put into them, which they regain by resting. It's that extra life that allows them to heal so quickly and such.

Meaning that Hemalurgy is kind of a vampiric process of combining life energies (at least the 8 for the chest) to make Super-beings. The different metals showing how the different lives sustain the inquisitor, or augment the abilities he already has. They get the full powers of a mistborn because they already have part, and the increase power gives them it in full.

[Comatose]

That's interesting, and I like it.  They use seekers because they are already mistings, and then they sacrifice more mistings, and give the inquisitors a boost up to full mistborn!  And in Alendi's day, the piercing made him more copetent, even if he didn't notice it, he didn't have spikes, he had piercings, so it was just slight.  But what was used as sacrifice, for Alendi's meager power boost, did goats or something suffice.
There's holes, but I really really like this theory!  Maybe this is why Vin is so powerful?  Who knows, but here's a thought, what if KAndra or Koloss were used as sacrifices?  I wonder what would happen then?
Oh, and the Koloss's nails, perhaps to the Lord Ruler used Hemalurgy to create them, maybe.
I really really like this theory, good job Qarlin!

[Qarlin]

Thanks.

Vin's power boost is not so meager, but then, she prolly started with more than most Inquisitors, too.

[Comatose]

It's true, but maybe the earring just boosts her bronze, and there are other explanations for her other allomatic abilities being so powerful, I don't think she should be able to replicate what the inquisitors get with 11 spikes, with one earring.

[Qarlin]

Yeah, but she's not as powerful as inquisitors, either. Is it an older sister that died? Younger? Twin?

[SarahG]

I'm pretty sure Vin's sister was younger.  I was looking for the reference when I noticed this:

MB1, p.206

One, Vin noticed in a moment of shock, had been Ulef.  The boy's face was contorted and pained, the front of his chest a mass of broken bones and ripped flesh - as if someone had forcibly torn the ribcage apart with his hands.

And a couple pages later, p.208

there was only a single corpse tied to a chair.  In the weak light she could barely make out that his eyes had been gouged out.

These sound like they could be related to Hemalurgical sacrifices.  As far as I know, neither Ulef nor Milev were Allomancers or Feruchemists.  Does this advance our discussion at all?

[Comatose]

Perhaps it has something to do with information getting, maybe they were able to tear the information out using hemalurgy??
Your right, it is similar to the ritual.  Good Find 

[Reaves]

eh, im pretty sure its just a gruesome description of what the Steel Ministry is capable of. I mean, you hardly need hemalurgy to tear information out of someone when that same someone has just seen his best friend's ribcage ripped apart??