Author Topic: Ruin and Preservation  (Read 60265 times)

Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #60 on: March 20, 2008, 03:51:13 PM »
I believe the secrets must lie within the magic triad and the duality between Ruin and Preservation. Our theoretical knowledge of those is very little, so I doubt there is a fourth magic system. Three is complex enough :P
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darxbane

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #61 on: March 20, 2008, 04:02:29 PM »
I certainly agree with you there, Chaos.  For some reason, I keep thinking about Mashadar (Wheel of Time Reference).  Could the mists be a living entity/entities?  Or, an energy that changes depending on the amount of good or evil in the world? 
I wanted to write something profound here, but I couldn't think of anything.

Comatose

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #62 on: March 20, 2008, 09:06:47 PM »
Maybe not another entire magic system, but I still believe that that they are defeinately a force that both Ruin and Preservation can maipulate, maybe not anothe rmagic system, but perhaps just a power they both possess.  I theorized on the hemalurgy thread that th mists have something to do with that.
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Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #63 on: March 21, 2008, 02:09:43 PM »
I had an idea yesterday that, despite the evidence to the contrary, the Mists are not the Deepness. Or, at least, not in the way the mists are now.

If they were the Deepness, the would be referenced more. I'm pretty sure that people would make the connection Deepness = mist eventually like they do in current times.

However, Kwaan says the Deepness came on suddenly. Why did it do that? Obviously, that is Ruin's doing, but why not drum up the Deepness all the time? There's no Lord Ruler to stop him.

Or why, for that matter, did the Lord Ruler keep the mists out? If the Deepness wasn't out all the time, that means it isn't a perpetual thing.

Just something to think about.
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Comatose

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #64 on: March 22, 2008, 01:53:59 AM »
That would be quite the twist if the mists weren't the deepness, but I'm pretty sure that they are.
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Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #65 on: March 27, 2008, 02:04:56 AM »
Okay, so I reread Mistborn 1--or rather finished it yesterday. I have a couple of thoughts. First, the Lord Ruler's throne room looks very, very cool (Chapter 37). It looks like mist, which implies the Lord Ruler is... well, obsessed with the mists.

Furthermore, there is a conversation, I think with Vin and Sazed, where Sazed says that "all the legends agree that the first Allomancers appeared when the mists came out). Now, since the logbook fails to mention Allomancers--or, for that matter, mists existing during the night--we can make the inference that these "legends" are fairly accurate. That implies, then, that the Deepness is not the mists, or at least not the mists we knew in the Lord Ruler's time.

Perhaps the mists are slowly reverting back to their "Deepness" form. Perhaps the mists are not the Deepness at all--which sort of kills book 2, but there is some evidence against the Deepness/Ruin being the mists.
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #66 on: March 27, 2008, 02:42:46 AM »
Let's just say, Chaos2651, that there is a problem with one of your assumptions which means that the quote you found turns out not to be evidence against what you think it's evidence against.

That's a very good find though and a significant clue I don't think I caught the last time I read Mistborn 1. R(Mistborn 3)AFO.
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Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #67 on: March 27, 2008, 04:16:25 AM »
If you don't mind me tearing apart your words:

1. I hate you for reading MB3. :P Just kidding... a little.
2. Well, then, the quote is evidence about SOMETHING about the mists. That's something--something good.  It's just something I don't know about, because MB3 is something we haven't read yet.

Personally, I don't really like my theory there. It makes everything so easy to assume that the Deepness/Ruin is the mists... I just don't know how it all fits together.
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Comatose

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #68 on: March 27, 2008, 09:45:11 PM »
Vin keeps saying that the lord ruler changed the world when he took the power, he proabably changed the mists to stop the deepness, and now that he's gone they are reverting to their origingal form, but something about the log book still bugs me, the fact that he never mentions the mists, except in reference to the mist spirit if the deepness is the mists, wouldn't he immediately connect the two??/
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Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #69 on: March 27, 2008, 09:51:21 PM »
Maybe... maybe the quote means that Allomancy causes the mists? Or something?
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Comatose

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #70 on: March 27, 2008, 10:00:11 PM »
The mists respond to allomancy, hemalurgy pushes them away, the mists kill and come during the day, and also manifest the mist spirit, hemalurgy requires a blood sacrifice, (possibly skaa blood), allomancy and feruchemy are hereditary, the first allomancers came with the mists, the lord ruler wanted to ensure no two powers mixed.  All these things must be connected somehow, and it all comes back to the mists.  There's something we are missing about the mists.
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Chaos

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #71 on: March 27, 2008, 11:11:15 PM »
I hope there is. I want MB3 to answer all of these questions, and even if Brandon had 250k words, I am beginning to doubt that questions so vast can all be explained!
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Comatose

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #72 on: March 27, 2008, 11:54:15 PM »
unless, of course, there is a ky point we are missing that unlocks all the answers.
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darxbane

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #73 on: March 28, 2008, 06:35:56 PM »
Well of course we are missing something!  :) And, I am sure reading MB3 will answer all of these questions.
I wanted to write something profound here, but I couldn't think of anything.

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Re: Ruin and Preservation
« Reply #74 on: March 28, 2008, 10:52:56 PM »
I think there's something we're missing that we can figure out from the books we have though.  So far, Brandon's been really good a subtley forshadowing things, making very important things seem very unimportant, often just mentioning them in passing once or twice and then coming back to them later.  I'm sure there another secret left to uncover that's in the already published books.

Then again, "there's always another secret." ??? ;D

Modification:
Ok, I've been rereading this thread again, and something jumped out at me.  A little earlier there was some talk about the well holding the power of both ruin and presercation and that the hero got to decide.  I'm not sure if this has been touchedo n, but it pretty much says this in the book.  In the passages about the prophecy I'm pretty sure it says something about the hero bringing ruin in his wake and yet bringing stability or something like that, wouldn't that be the same as finding the balance?  Oh, and I've also been thinking, if Ruin is what was trapped in the well, then why is the power that Vin and the Lord Ruler took the "power of creation."  My guess would be that the power is not of ruin or preservation, because creation is neither really, preservation is lack of change, ruin is destruction, so would that mean there is a third party?  Brandon seems to like threes.  Three created creatures, three magic systems... Oh, and have you noticed the magic systems sort of have their own affinity for ruin or preservation.  Feruchemists are very much preservation, they store and preserve knowledge, while the Inquisitors, who we know have something to do with hemalurgy, can hear the voice of ruin, does that mean allomancy has something to do with creation.  Forgive me, I'm rambling, and not spitting out anything conclusive, but what if Creation is the state of balance between ruin and preservation?  Just some food for thought.

And is it jsut me, or is ruin not the only thing that is bound, if ruin is so powerful, and there is supposed to be balance, shouldn't preservation be powerful too, however the mist spirit doesn't seem to be overly powerful, and is unable to speak, maybe ruin and preservation trapped eachother, preservation sealed ruin away with its opposite: creation, and ruin trapped Preservation in the mists, maybe the mists are just ruin's tools, and preservation is trapped wihin them, again, I'm not even sure, this is just the sound of me rambling and my head exploding ;D
« Last Edit: March 30, 2008, 03:15:09 AM by Comatose »
"Look, I'm just trying to change the world, okay?  I don't have time for a grudge match with every poser in a parka!"
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"There's always another secret..."
- Kelsier