Timewaster's Guide Archive

I might as well wish that Brandon had included more pink unicorns, because I felt a distinct lack of them in the series

i too felt the lack. i cry every night into my blanky embroidered with those same pink unicorns because of the lack of them in Mistborn. I'm making Brandon promise to include them in an additional Mistborn trilogy.  And yes, they will be attracted to each other without only thinking of sex. It's not like unicorns are all horny buggers...geez.

Personally, I'm the type of guy that likes "No Guts, No Glory" stories, but i do think that romance can make any story MUCH better. While I wish there had been a tad more in the Elend/Vin department, I dont think much more could have been done without it feeling tacked on. Lets face it, we all knew they were gonna get together from the first ball.

This is why Breeze's tension, Spook's (to a degree) and especially Sazed's tension were so important in the story. I mean, the romantic tension and then the tragedy for Sazed in book 2 set up arguably the most important parts of book 3.  Romantic tension and the tragedy that results from it formed the basis for Kel's life in book 1. I'd say the novels are in good shape considering the themes and what was at stake.

before this get entirely derailed and it devolves into "no, you should think this" let's cut a few things out of these comments:

1. stop with the generalizations.  just cause 1 person does something does not make it the same across an entire genre, gender, religion, etc (you get the picture).

2. telling a person that you doubt they think how they do isn't helpful to the discussion.  if someone says they dont think that way, then they don't.  its not up to you to question their character. 

I didn't think of every girl sexually, am i gonna get called a liar too? different people are different.  period.

as far as all of this relates to novels, each author has their own comfort-zone. some have no probs putting sexuality in in any form.  some prefer that it all have meaning. some throw it in for shock value.  to each his (or her) own. I tend to agree with prior posters who said that I don't think the lack (or the very subtle nature of it) did harm to the novels. I just dont think it would have fit in Mistborn.  That being said, I dont doubt that if Brandon decided to put some more detailed scenes in, that they would be tasteful and have a strong reason for their presence. 

Seconded for Lynch's Lies of Locke Lamora. I'd like to know where I can get some more of that

On the subject of Lynch, you may also look at the First Law series by Joe Abercrombie.  It feels like a more distilled Steven Erikson story but with the wit of Scott Lynch (though in later books, Erikson has plenty of wit himself).  The torturer character in the Abercrombie books is full of win.

To go back a few posts, the main purpose for the wolves at the last battle was shown in book 10 during Perrin's boring section.  They are there to counter Dark Hounds.  Remember, everything is about balance.  For everything the Shadow has, there are counter-parts for the Light.  Remember, wolves hate the Shadow Brothers worse than Trollocs or Fades (as Dark Hounds were once wolves themselves).

Shaggy - I think you are misunderstanding what I saying.  What I am saying is that using Brandon's personal work as evidence how RJ will end the WoT doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.   If you were comparing a Brandon Book to a Brandon book, then sure.  Or a RJ book to a RJ book, sure.  If two people's novels were written at the same relative time, and they had very striking similarities, then sure, comparisons are natural (Martin vs Erikson, Goodkind vs Jordan, Butcher vs Richardson vs all other Urban Fantasy).  But RJ and Brandon's story ideas are pretty different on the whole.  Like I said, I just think that using one author to prove how another author wrote his own novel's end seems a bit off in this case.

Publius - Yeah, we are totally walking in a very gray area.  I think we could each decide that Character A could be considered Major or 'just' important.  See, i'd argue that if a character makes a huge impact in 1 book and that impact affects how other main character majorly act, then to me thats a major character.  You are totally right about the dangers of killing off people though.  You better have an amazing replacement.  Good call there.

Happyman - I hope to heck that you are right.  I hope characters bite-it left and right at the end.  I dont think it likely, but I hope it happens.  Because up until now, I've never felt any character was in any danger (one of my main criticisms).  There has always been something that pulls them out of the fire.  Sure they get hurt here and there, but I've never expected any character to be in danger of dying up to this point.  Unless balefire is involved, it's hard to consider anyone dead or in danger of dying at all.  I do want to point out to you that I could argue that,  in say, Steven Erikson's series (13 total stories so far), you know from very early on that characters can and will die.  It gives his series a pattern.  I consider that series to be just  long story just like you consider WoT to be the same.  Therefore, I could argue that the lack of deaths that "stick" in WoT hints that the ending may very likely be the same.  But, I do see your point, and I hope you are right.  It would redeem the series for me.

Quote from: Shaggy on January 05, 2009, 11:00:03 PM

Remember Kelsier?

I fail to see how that is relevant.  This isn't Brandon's book, the list of who lives and who dies was written by Robert Jordan.

Exactly.  What does Kelsier making a martyr of himself have to do with RJ's WoT?  Im not picking a fight, im just saying that we need to keep the 2 stories separate.

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Oh, and as far as Major Fantasy Series having MAJOR characters getting killed off early, it happens all the time.  Erikson and Martin are the big players in that realm.

I'm going to argue that with the exception of Kelsier from Mistborn, that if a major character dies early in a series he's not really that major of a character.  Kelsier is different because he is the foundation of a religion, so the series would be vastly different if he didn't die.

No disrespect to my friend Brandon, but he hardly has the monopoly on being the only author to have an important character die early on.  If you have read Martin, then you know that Edard Stark was an EXTREMELY important character.  If you've read Erikson, then you know that Whiskyjack was perhaps the MOST important character up until the point he bites it.  By your same argument, the entire face of these fantasy series (6 total stories in Martin's world and 13 in Erikson's) would have been drastically altered.  However, I do agree with you that the death of a character hardly matters in the least if their death has no ramifications on the rest of the story.

 

1) The entire Wheel of Time series is one story.  Sure, the first book has a halfway decent ending, but even it has some dangling ends (like the last paragraph).  Thus it is absolutely impossible to know who lives and who dies based on previous books.  I've only read one story by RJ (the Wheel of Time) and I haven't seen the end, so his "death style" is completely unknown.  Some main characters will certainly survive.  Some may well die.

I see what you are saying, but my opinion is that this isnt fully accurate.  I feel it is pretty easy to tell how a story may be told from the previous portions of a story.  Brandon killed off Kelsier in the "first section" of the story.  So it was full expected of him to kill of main characters in "parts" 2 and 3.  George R R Martin makes it pretty obvious after the first part of his story that no one is safe.  Erikson is the same.  Joe Abercrombie has his own pattern.  No matter how long the story, or how many volumes it is broken up into, you begin to see a pattern to individual stories.  Now, RJ could very well have decided that he wanted to kill everyone at the end, but i doubt it.  His early sections of the story dont show any precedent for that.  He cares too much for them, and has worked too many loop-holes into the series to allow for the escape of whomever he desires.