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Local Authors => Brandon Sanderson => Topic started by: Randomness on March 15, 2010, 10:14:54 PM

Title: Larasium?
Post by: Randomness on March 15, 2010, 10:14:54 PM
So i guess that Larasium was the small bead of metal that Elend burned, when he was in the area of the Well of Ascension in the second book. So if that metal is the body of Preservation, then why would it let you burn the body of Ruin, it's exact opposite? Just wondering...
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: sortitus on March 15, 2010, 10:34:04 PM
Simply put, that is just a side-effect of burning it. It enhances your body to be able to handle the metals, but its "primary" function is something else. I've no idea what that is, however.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Eerongal on March 15, 2010, 10:41:47 PM
Simply put, that is just a side-effect of burning it. It enhances your body to be able to handle the metals, but its "primary" function is something else. I've no idea what that is, however.

^That.

Unless i missed something, the actual effects of it are still unknown, at least to us not "in the know" with brandon.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Randomness on March 15, 2010, 11:01:59 PM
Simply put, that is just a side-effect of burning it. It enhances your body to be able to handle the metals, but its "primary" function is something else. I've no idea what that is, however.

^That.

Unless i missed something, the actual effects of it are still unknown, at least to us not "in the know" with brandon.
I though it gave you mistborn abilities, and thats it. i could be wrong though. Someone should ask Brandon.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: douglas on March 15, 2010, 11:41:14 PM
I though it gave you mistborn abilities, and thats it. i could be wrong though. Someone should ask Brandon.
Someone did.  His answer is where the mistborn=side-effect comments come from.  As I recall, he also said a Lerasium spike would make you a mistborn, again as a side effect of what it actually does.  I don't remember exactly where these quotes are from, though.  Some Q&A session, online or at a convention or book-signing, I'm not sure which.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Eerongal on March 16, 2010, 12:01:14 AM
Simply put, that is just a side-effect of burning it. It enhances your body to be able to handle the metals, but its "primary" function is something else. I've no idea what that is, however.

^That.

Unless i missed something, the actual effects of it are still unknown, at least to us not "in the know" with brandon.
I though it gave you mistborn abilities, and thats it. i could be wrong though. Someone should ask Brandon.

Yeah, that's a side-effect. If, for example, vin were to have took it instead of elend, it would have done something else had she burned it.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Link von Kelsier Harvey XXIV on March 16, 2010, 12:06:14 AM
All the side effect talk actually came from one of the annotations if I remember correctly.  Then someone asked Brandon what would happen if a mistborn burned it, assuming its allomantic effect to be its primary effect.  The answer was that the mistborn's allomantic powers would be permanently increased, which led to some disappointment after all the side effect speculation.  But now that you mention it, no one bothered to find out about it's feruchemical or hemalurgic effects.  ... My initial reaction was to think that Brandon made a bad call here when he called it a side effect, and move on. But the crazy fandumb epileptic trees part of me wonders if there's something deeper here.  As far as Lerasium spikes go, it makes sense that if you can use Atium in Allomancy, you should be able to use Lerasium in Hemalurgy, but getting several powers at once almost seems too powerful.  Then again, the god metals don't seem very well matched.  One grants allomancy/increases allomantic strength, while the other lets you see the future?  Hmm...  Hey!  If we go with the several powers at once theory, that would make each god metal the most powerful metal in the other's magic system!  What madness is this?

Sorry for rambling.   :D

Side note: I am most likely completely wrong/reading way too much into things in my theorizing.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: sortitus on March 16, 2010, 12:25:35 AM
Well, it increases your burning efficiency, but I was under the impression that that was just the same side-effect and that the side effects stack on each other. So, if somebody had a whole bunch of Lerasium, they could use 1/10 the metal that somebody else would need to do the same thing (or not need duralumin/savant status to match up). They would also get some unknown effect while they are burning the metal.

Having atium spikes is likely a similar solution for a hemalurgist, increasing your "alignment" with the given side you are using. This is just idle speculation, so we'd need one of the professionals like Chaos to validate or disprove it. Or Brandon, if you have access to him. :P
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on March 27, 2010, 04:17:58 PM
I just thought about a thing...
1. We know that both Larasium and Atium are Preservation's and Ruin's "bodies", part of their souls, you can call it.
2. We know that hemalurgy is about stealing other's powers, and as Sazed said, part of their souls.

So, I wonder, that maybe Larasium and Atium would provide hemalurgic effects if the spikes aren't used to pierce someone's body. Because, they are already loaded! Loaded with Preservation's and Ruin's souls.
Or maybe it's like only Larasium can be used like this, because Ruin wanted his body only for himself, but Preservation gave his power to humanity, giving it up.


Also, I have a question. Since there is a balance, and there is never more Ruin than Preservation in total, does it mean that if atium comes back to earth after it's used, would Larasium do so as well? It takes hundred years for atium, and if larasium would, I think we have a storyline for the next possible book in Mistborn world, where there are only Mistings, and suddenly, the possibility of becoming a Mistborn reappears. How much chaos would that make and how people would react to it, it's a perfect background for a story of Mr. Sanderson.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on March 27, 2010, 06:44:37 PM
This is just idle speculation, so we'd need one of the professionals like Chaos to validate or disprove it.

I'm just a professional speculator :P
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Omelethead on March 28, 2010, 04:10:28 AM
Also, I have a question. Since there is a balance, and there is never more Ruin than Preservation in total, does it mean that if atium comes back to earth after it's used, would Larasium do so as well? It takes hundred years for atium, and if larasium would, I think we have a storyline for the next possible book in Mistborn world, where there are only Mistings, and suddenly, the possibility of becoming a Mistborn reappears. How much chaos would that make and how people would react to it, it's a perfect background for a story of Mr. Sanderson.

I think that the mists are where most of Preservation's body is found. We've seen Dark Mists, which were of Ruin, but the mists that come out at night (and that Vin uses to fuel her Allomancy at the end of Book 1 & 3) are Preservation's body.


There may be a Lerasium mine somewhere (Peter gave me a RAFO), but the majority of Preservation's body is in Mist form.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Terrisman243 on April 01, 2010, 07:17:50 AM
Or it was in Mist form. Maybe now that there's not Mist, maybe the Lerasium Mine will increase.

Oh! I have an old idea of what the real affect is for Lerasium. What if it is the old idea of Invincibility while you burn it? It was a pretty nasty wound that Elend recovered from...... But I suppose that the wound falls under the Lerasium-strength pewter burning he  had.

Another random speculation. I believe that all of the people on the other pole are all tunnel tiggers. I think that TLR moved them mostly underground to stay safe from Ruin.

To answer Rezo's question, yes all of the power must equal each other, but it doesn't have to equal each other in every form. In other words, the amount of Atium in the world doesn't have to equal the amount of Lerasium. And if it had, then Vin would've noticed it. Vin noticed that Ruin was equal to her, because Preservation gave up some of the power to make people intelligent, and some of Ruin's power was put into the Atium.

That answer leads me to another question- how would've Ruin gotten the power from the Atium? Would his spiritual self touch the Pits, making all of the Atium suddenly disapear? Or would've the koloss had to injest the Atium, then he grabs the power from their bodies?

I'm not sure. What is the fine for joining the Guild of Speculators?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 01, 2010, 04:42:15 PM
The "god-mode" Larasium powered effect is a great idea. It would explain how TLR could have recovered from cutting his head off, burning in flames almost to bones, ripping off his skin and all the other stuff that happened to him ealier.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Peter Ahlstrom on April 01, 2010, 05:38:46 PM
TLR lied about some of those things, or encouraged rumors that were not true.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 01, 2010, 06:34:22 PM
TLR lied about some of those things, or encouraged rumors that were not true.
But, like, all of them? It's impossible for a man, no matter how powerful, to take control of almost whole world and not get almost-killed even once, or isn't it?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Link von Kelsier Harvey XXIV on April 01, 2010, 07:05:51 PM
I imagine that something that would have killed anyone else, but not like having his skin ripped off, happened to him, but he used his crazy allomantic feruchemy healing to get all better.  As the story of his recovery spread, the wounds he sustained became more extreme with each re-telling, and he never bothered to correct them.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: douglas on April 01, 2010, 07:39:28 PM
Rashek certainly did get very badly wounded at least once and used his Feruchemical healing powered up with Allomancy to recover, but Brandon stated (I think in the old Q&A thread) that if he had actually been beheaded it would have killed him.  There is some truth to the tales about him, but just how severe the wounds were has been exaggerated through countless retellings.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 01, 2010, 09:48:21 PM
But still, the regeneration/immortality lerasium effect is one of the most probable theories.
Hmm...
Ruin + Preservation = God
These two complete each other, so I think that lerasium and atium complete each other like this too. I guess that someone burning both atium and lerasium would be invincible.
That's why this theory fits. Atium for perfect offence, lerasium for perfect defence.

My second thought is - maybe if lerasium is burned with any other metal, it would enchant not only the Mistborn, but the metals themselfes? We didn't exactly see the effect of lerasium burned by a Mistborn, but maybe that's the trick - to make metals that already are inside his stomach much longer, if not forever?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Ari54 on April 01, 2010, 11:50:04 PM
Ruin and preservation working together ala Sazed is what we'd probably see if any two Shards of Adonalsium worked together. :)
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 02, 2010, 03:04:27 AM
Ruin and preservation working together ala Sazed is what we'd probably see if any two Shards of Adonalsium worked together. :)
Any two that fit each other as perfectly as Ruin and Preservation do.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Link von Kelsier Harvey XXIV on April 02, 2010, 08:19:12 PM
Ruin and preservation working together ala Sazed is what we'd probably see if any two Shards of Adonalsium worked together. :)
Any two that fit each other as perfectly as Ruin and Preservation do.

Which of course leads to the speculation that they might come in pairs.  Hmm... what would we get if we mixed Preservation with, say, Endowment?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: zas678 on April 02, 2010, 11:44:12 PM
That would be odd. it seems then that the people of Endowment would be all about giving what they had to others to help better their lives (like the people of Hallandren give to the Court of Gods), but the people of Preservation would end up just keeping what they had.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Ari54 on April 04, 2010, 02:54:54 AM
Any two that fit each other as perfectly as Ruin and Preservation do.

I think that's a matter of wait and see! :)
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 04, 2010, 04:28:38 PM
I just thought about something...
We know that for every normal metal there is one working alloy.
We know that both Larasium and Atium can be alloyed with all of the basic metals.

But could there be an alloy of Larasium and Atium?
Laratium maybe?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 05, 2010, 12:17:29 AM
I just thought about something...
We know that for every normal metal there is one working alloy.
We know that both Larasium and Atium can be alloyed with all of the basic metals.

But could there be an alloy of Larasium and Atium?
Laratium maybe?
You're not the first to wonder that, it's one of the questions we've been wanting to have Brandon answer, but I do like the name.  I say we should call it Laratium from now on!
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Morderkaine on April 05, 2010, 12:54:59 AM
I think a Lerasium/Atium alloy should be called Sazedium.

logic:
Preservation was bound to Leras and the metal is Lerasium.
Ruin was bound to Ati and the metal is Atium.
Both are now bound to Sazed and the metal is Sazedium.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 05, 2010, 08:09:42 PM
I think this reasoning is wrong.
Sazed is not a power himself - he is the consiousness that hold those two (separated) powers together. Atium is still atium, larasium is still larasium, for the powers aren't connected - they are just controlled by one entity.

But I like how "sazedium" sounds.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: zas678 on April 05, 2010, 10:35:12 PM
Lerasium is derived from the name Leras, the cognitive force (?) behind the Shard of Preservation.
Atium is derived from the name Ati, the cognitive force behind the Shard of Ruin.

Sazedium would be derived from the name Sazed, the cognitive force behind the Shards of Ruin and Preservation
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 05, 2010, 10:56:47 PM
Lerasium is derived from the name Leras, the cognitive force (?) behind the Shard of Preservation.
Atium is derived from the name Ati, the cognitive force behind the Shard of Ruin.

Sazedium would be derived from the name Sazed, the cognitive force behind the Shards of Ruin and Preservation
I thought this too, but Sazedium doesn't really roll off the tongue to me.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 06, 2010, 12:31:20 AM
But you're missing one thing - we are talking about an alloy here.
The larasium-atium alloy wouldn't come from Sazed, but from humans, smelting these two metals into an alloy. Now if Sazed would ever want to put both Shards into a new metal, it wouldn't be the same substance as the larasium-atium alloy we're talking about.
As I see it...
Sazedium - metal created by both Shards together.
Larasium - alloy created by melting each Shard's metals together.
Would it be the same? Well, THAT's the real discussion topic.

As I thought about it, I have a theory...
Burned Sazedium/Laratium will make you into an Feruchemist.
Why? Because it would take the power of Larasium and add an equal dose of Ruin to it. Instead of giving the power of Preservation, it would now grand the power of balance.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Terrisman243 on April 06, 2010, 03:57:27 PM
Except doesn't Sazed say that Furchemy is of neither Preservation or Ruin?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: happyman on April 06, 2010, 04:44:02 PM
Except doesn't Sazed say that Furchemy is of neither Preservation or Ruin?

Feruchemy is of both!
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 06, 2010, 05:16:29 PM
The origin of Feruchemy, and why only the Terris seem to have it, is still very much an open matter.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: JCHancey on April 06, 2010, 09:08:40 PM
Except doesn't Sazed say that Furchemy is of neither Preservation or Ruin?

Feruchemy is of both!

Pretty sure it says Feruchemy is of Preservation, Hemalurgy of Ruin, and Allomancy of both
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Creative_Vortx on April 06, 2010, 09:10:40 PM
Except doesn't Sazed say that Furchemy is of neither Preservation or Ruin?

Feruchemy is of both!

Pretty sure it says Feruchemy is of Preservation, Hemalurgy of Ruin, and Allomancy of both

^ I remember it like this ^
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: douglas on April 06, 2010, 09:14:20 PM
I am quite certain that it is Allomancy is of Preservation, Hemalurgy is of Ruin, and Feruchemy is of both.

Even aside from my memory of the quote, Lerasium is Preservation solidified, and it makes you an Allomancer, not a Feruchemist.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 06, 2010, 11:34:49 PM
I am quite certain that it is Allomancy is of Preservation, Hemalurgy is of Ruin, and Feruchemy is of both.

Even aside from my memory of the quote, Lerasium is Preservation solidified, and it makes you an Allomancer, not a Feruchemist.
Exactly.
Feruchemy - balance
Allomancy - Preservation
Hemalurgy - Ruin

And we aren't talking about Larasium now, but about potential Larasium-Atium alloy (my proposed name for this is laratium). And my theory is that such metal would make you into a Feruchemist.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 07, 2010, 04:17:25 PM
Except doesn't Sazed say that Furchemy is of neither Preservation or Ruin?

Feruchemy is of both!

Pretty sure it says Feruchemy is of Preservation, Hemalurgy of Ruin, and Allomancy of both

^ I remember it like this ^

Allomancy is absolutely of Preservation.

Page 221 of the Hero of Ages hardback:

Quote
Allomancy, obviously, is of Preservation. The rational mind will see this. For, in the case of Allomancy, net power is gained. It is provided by an external source--Preservation's own body.

Sazed totally just called you all irrational ;) Hahaha.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Technomancer on April 07, 2010, 10:44:33 PM
Wasn't it said that an alloy of Larasium and another Allomantic metal would create a Mistling that could burn that metal.  Ajtium Mistlings (Seers) have been shown so I would assume that a Larasium-Atium alloy would just create a Mistling who can only burn Atium.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 08, 2010, 02:13:01 PM
Wasn't it said that an alloy of Larasium and another Allomantic metal would create a Mistling that could burn that metal.  Ajtium Mistlings (Seers) have been shown so I would assume that a Larasium-Atium alloy would just create a Mistling who can only burn Atium.
And that's the most obvious answer. But it's said that an Atium alloy with any metal would cause "various expanded physical and mental allomantic effects", or something like that. Besides, I don't think that Brandon would solve such interesting problem in such a way.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: JCHancey on April 08, 2010, 03:59:26 PM
bah my bad, shouldn't be commenting in forums with little or no sleep.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Creative_Vortx on April 08, 2010, 05:20:46 PM
bah my bad, shouldn't be commenting in forums with little or no sleep.

I have no excuse, I'm just too lazy to think it through aparently.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 08, 2010, 07:23:02 PM
At least, Sazed thought it was obvious.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Link von Kelsier Harvey XXIV on April 09, 2010, 03:44:45 AM
Wasn't he kind of GOD when he said that though?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 09, 2010, 06:52:17 AM
This is quite true :P
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 10, 2010, 12:25:56 AM
The concept of an atium misting doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
If your ability to be an allomancer comes from the amount of preservation you have letting you tap into its power, and the burning of atium is fueling allomancy through concentrated ruin; does it seem logical that the power of preservation would produce something that doesn't actually tap into preservation's power at all, but, instead, ruin's?
I'm pretty sure that's not a run-on sentence.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 10, 2010, 12:49:20 AM
That's true, I never thought about it like this. I think we should dig into this.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Omelethead on April 17, 2010, 01:07:54 AM
The concept of an atium misting doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
If your ability to be an allomancer comes from the amount of preservation you have letting you tap into its power, and the burning of atium is fueling allomancy through concentrated ruin; does it seem logical that the power of preservation would produce something that doesn't actually tap into preservation's power at all, but, instead, ruin's?
I'm pretty sure that's not a run-on sentence.

I agree. I might accept it a little easier if an Atium Misting was actually just a Temporal metal misting of some sort, but even then, it doesn't quite fit.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Patriotic Kaz on April 17, 2010, 08:10:29 PM
It makes sense because Preservation stole Ruin's body and by hiding it in the earth Leras must have incorporated it into his own magic. I mean Leras had Ati's body so he could do anything with it except destroy it, why not make it into a metal (easier to hide it that way).
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 17, 2010, 08:18:17 PM
But the fact that it was stolen doesn't change it's power itself, does it? If it would, then Atium would be totally useless for Ruin.
But, if you think about it, it shouldn't be a problem. Allomancy doesn't use the power of Preservation, but instead it's just created by it. Preservation's and Ruin's power doesn't really collide then - you just burn the metal and release the power kept in it. Be it any kind of power.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Ari54 on April 19, 2010, 10:03:29 AM
But the fact that it was stolen doesn't change it's power itself, does it? If it would, then Atium would be totally useless for Ruin.
But, if you think about it, it shouldn't be a problem. Allomancy doesn't use the power of Preservation, but instead it's just created by it. Preservation's and Ruin's power doesn't really collide then - you just burn the metal and release the power kept in it. Be it any kind of power.

Allomancy is described in the books as fueled by Preservation's body. I'm not sure where you get that it doesn't use the power of Preservation- it's just an up-front use.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 19, 2010, 09:18:04 PM
Must re-read the HoA and probably the rest too, I'm making more and more mistakes :)
Sorry, and thanks for pointing it out.

But anyway, you can't disagree that burning atium have nothing to do with powering yourself with Preservation.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 20, 2010, 03:02:19 AM
But the fact that it was stolen doesn't change it's power itself, does it? If it would, then Atium would be totally useless for Ruin.
But, if you think about it, it shouldn't be a problem. Allomancy doesn't use the power of Preservation, but instead it's just created by it. Preservation's and Ruin's power doesn't really collide then - you just burn the metal and release the power kept in it. Be it any kind of power.

Allomancy is described in the books as fueled by Preservation's body. I'm not sure where you get that it doesn't use the power of Preservation- it's just an up-front use.
Allomancy is of Preservation, but Atium is concentrated Ruin.  A Mistborn is able to use Atium because they can use every metal, but what I'm pointing out is that why would it work that Preservation's power create the ability to only use a metal that is distinctly not of Preservation?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Elusive Fehler on April 20, 2010, 03:32:46 AM
I think that Brandon has said that Leras actually changed the magic system, making Atium part of the Table and shifting off the other(normal) Temporal metals.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Link von Kelsier Harvey XXIV on April 20, 2010, 03:50:56 AM
Where'd ya hear that?
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 20, 2010, 04:13:34 AM
I think that Brandon has said that Leras actually changed the magic system, making Atium part of the Table and shifting off the other(normal) Temporal metals.

This is a true statement, but this applies to what metals are actually on the table. It doesn't address the open of question of Atium and how Allomancer's burn it.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Renoard on April 20, 2010, 12:44:38 PM
It seemed a slight plot hole for both Ruin and Preservation to have bodies/power that condenses into metal.  But I think Brandon tried to address that by having Sazed point out that they were "two sides of one coin."  But as for burning Atium, Some previously pointed out that Larasium or Snapping is just a catalyst that prepares the body to burn metals.  Once the ability exists, the metal is just a matter of which metals are sources of power.

The question that occurs to me is whether copper, tin, iron, zinc and the other allomantic, elemental metals are the "bodies" of other slivers. ;)
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 21, 2010, 01:34:53 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 21, 2010, 05:57:55 PM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Chaos on April 21, 2010, 10:32:28 PM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.

A logical question, then, would be what would happen if a non-Allomancer ate atium much in the same manner that someone takes lerasium.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Miyabi on April 21, 2010, 11:05:23 PM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.

A logical question, then, would be what would happen if a non-Allomancer ate atium much in the same manner that someone takes lerasium.

This happened on a regular basis.  That's how they discovered Seers.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 22, 2010, 02:02:28 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.

A logical question, then, would be what would happen if a non-Allomancer ate atium much in the same manner that someone takes lerasium.

This happened on a regular basis.  That's how they discovered Seers.

But they were already Allomancers, Seers, and the Atium simply brought that fact to light.

But the thing is that the power of Ruin may be tied to a magic system, but Hemalurgy doesn't naturally occur like Allomancy does.  Lerasium, however, is.  What Lerasium does is significantly increase the amount of Preservation present in a person.  If Atium does the same for Ruin, it'd be more likely to drive them insane then give them any magical power.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Renoard on April 22, 2010, 04:41:18 AM
How about this, feed an Elantrian Laraium and Atium. ;P
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 22, 2010, 06:13:41 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.

A logical question, then, would be what would happen if a non-Allomancer ate atium much in the same manner that someone takes lerasium.

This happened on a regular basis.  That's how they discovered Seers.

But they were already Allomancers, Seers, and the Atium simply brought that fact to light.

They needed to check if somebody's is a Seer or not, so most people who were eating it were just normal people.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 23, 2010, 01:06:57 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.
But you missed one thing - ANYBODY can burn Larasium.

A logical question, then, would be what would happen if a non-Allomancer ate atium much in the same manner that someone takes lerasium.

This happened on a regular basis.  That's how they discovered Seers.

But they were already Allomancers, Seers, and the Atium simply brought that fact to light.

They needed to check if somebody's is a Seer or not, so most people who were eating it were just normal people.
But they were already Seers, they just didn't know it yet.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: douglas on April 23, 2010, 02:47:42 AM
But they were already Seers, they just didn't know it yet.
The people who passed the test and turned out to be Seers, yes.  He's talking about all the other people who did not pass.  Those people were just ordinary non-Allomancers, and they consumed a small amount of Atium with no apparent effect.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 23, 2010, 03:47:52 AM
But they were already Seers, they just didn't know it yet.
The people who passed the test and turned out to be Seers, yes.  He's talking about all the other people who did not pass.  Those people were just ordinary non-Allomancers, and they consumed a small amount of Atium with no apparent effect.
Oh, okay, I was misinterpreting the statement, thank you for clearing that up for me.

Well, we don't know if they were unaffected, they weren't mentioned for the simple fact that they weren't affected.  Perhaps if we took a closer look at these people we'd find some interesting goings-on farther down the line.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Renoard on April 23, 2010, 04:00:48 AM
The only people we every read about taking Atium are allomancers.  Namely, Yomen, various mistborn and the mistfallen.  We can presume that the ministries tested all obligators, but it's an assumption, since Vin informs us that common belief was that Atium mistings were impossible.

Given that Brandon never included an ungifted human taking Atium, we can only make assumptions.  But that world is gone now anyway.  It's Sazed's world now and who knows where Brandon will take it assuming he ever returns to it.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Terrisman243 on April 23, 2010, 04:27:37 AM
It actually does. In the Hero of Ages Q&A, Brandon says...

Quote
They spike the drinks at one of the nobility's balls with trace amounts of Atium, then cause a bit disturbance.  (Often, the Inquisitors themselves arriving will do it) and burn bronze and watch for brief pulses.  The body will burn metals instinctively if it can, which has been shown quite often in the series.  This is also how they get a lot of their secret information about who is a Misting and who isn't.  It's not a perfect method, since you have to watch for Copperclouds messing things up, but it is effective once in a while. 

Any time an obligator who is not a Misting joins the Ministry, he is unknowingly given a larger chunk of atium and then forced into a series of rituals that will drain him physically and get the body to react and burn the metal.  This was how Yomen was discovered.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 23, 2010, 06:08:22 AM
When I said that Atium and Larasium were invented for Mistborn, I meant the books, not the people.

So all the obligators have taken Atium, yes?  Maybe that somewhat explains why things were so messed up in the government. :P
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Ari54 on April 27, 2010, 03:11:58 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.

Who said Preservation was the one who allowed Allomancers to burn Atium? ;) It could either have been a side-effect of Allomancy, or it could have been by Ruin's design.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Fireborn on April 27, 2010, 03:56:45 AM
But it's the wrong power.  Preservation creating a Misting that can only use a power not of him?  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Well, the biggest distinction between the God Metals (Atium and Lerasium) and the others is not only their source, but also that Atium and Lerasium were invented solely for Mistborn.

Who said Preservation was the one who allowed Allomancers to burn Atium? ;) It could either have been a side-effect of Allomancy, or it could have been by Ruin's design.
An interesting idea, the question to that, though, would be whether or not Ruin was able to have a conscious effect on the working's of Preservation's magic system and vice versa.  I'm inclined to say yes, due to what I consider to be the intertwined nature of the systems, but I wouldn't think it to be too great or else Ruin could just shut down all the Allomancers if he wanted to.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Rezo on April 27, 2010, 07:28:16 PM
But why would Ruin want people to burn Atium?
The only answer to that I can see would be that, maybe at the beginning atium was scattered all around the world, and he wanted to gather it in one place, Pits.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Comatose on April 29, 2010, 06:21:44 AM
Ruin wants people to burn atium, just not all of it.  Atium turns people into very efficient killing machines, and killing makes ruin happy.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Omelethead on April 29, 2010, 05:51:10 PM
Ruin may have made Atium so super powerful, so that it would be super valuable. People don't tend to lose valuable things, plus they will go to extremes to find it, and if people find it, Ruin finds it.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Renoard on May 29, 2010, 05:56:53 PM
Threads like this are world reaffirming for a reader response critic. :P  See how the world of the book has been detached from the author and made a common property, reinterpreted by the readers.  I love it.
Title: Re: Larasium?
Post by: Tasslehoof on June 03, 2010, 11:54:28 PM
Also, I have a question. Since there is a balance, and there is never more Ruin than Preservation in total, does it mean that if atium comes back to earth after it's used, would Larasium do so as well? It takes hundred years for atium, and if larasium would, I think we have a storyline for the next possible book in Mistborn world, where there are only Mistings, and suddenly, the possibility of becoming a Mistborn reappears. How much chaos would that make and how people would react to it, it's a perfect background for a story of Mr. Sanderson.

This would explain why Vin was so confused when she thought about that nugget of Larasium just laying there.  It could be that, like Atium, it slowly returns to the world.  After all, it doesn't really make sense that the Lord Ruler would just leave one Larasium nugget laying there "just in case".  He did have incredible foresight, but this just seems silly.

Another explanation for the nugget laying by the Well is just that Preservation, after stabbing Elend and realizing that Vin would release Ruin anyway, took part of it's "body" and placed it there to save Elend.

I'd rather the first be true, just because it sounds more exciting that more "pure" Mistborns, with exceptional strength like Elend's, could be born.