Timewaster's Guide Archive
General => Rants and Stuff => Topic started by: MsFish on March 03, 2006, 08:33:44 PM
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So, I've applied to the English MA program at BYU for the third year running. They've already rejected me twice, but I haven't felt right about leaving the area yet, and they have a good program for writing young adult fiction, so I keep applying.
I wasn't expecting to hear from them until the end of the month, but I got an email yesterday saying that while they've decided not to admit me, they've selected me as their third alternate.
They issue acceptance letters assuming that five people will turn them down. For every person above those five who turns them down, one alternate will get in. So essentially, eight out of thirty-five accepted applicants have to turn them down in order for me to be admitted.
What's more, I won't get final word on whether or not I'm accepted until the END OF MAY. I don't think ANYONE's letters have even been mailed yet. Ouch.
I feel like I've dropped into one of my novels. Or worse--one of someone else's novels, where everything is being set up for a dramatic climax, and I have no control over the outcome.
Jeez. At least it wasn't an outright rejection, although that might have been kinder than stringing me along for two months and *then* rejecting me.
*Fish takes a deep breath
Oh, the drama.
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Sorry to hear that, Fish. Really. :( Suspense like that is so hard. But at least there's some hope. Plus, if you feel that staying in UT is right, maybe this (or something better) will come through for you.
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Yeah, maybe. Or maybe I'll be stuck in retail for another year.
Argh.
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It is better than a total rejection though. Now if you could just get the list of people who applied we can scare at least 8 away. I think thats totally possible.
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Sorry to hear that, Fish. If it makes you feel any better (or gives you false hope so you can crash farther next time), my wife found out that last year, the TESOL MA program at BYU only ended up having half the class size they accepted because so many people didn't end up going. You have to remember that for a lot of these people, BYU is a second choice. (That's not meant to insult you--the Y was a first choice for me personally.) Plus, the average entering class size is a good . . . 45ish? I think that's how many--30-45, I'd guess. And they have an acceptance rate of 45%, so you figure about 60-100 people apply each year . . . I'd say you have a fair chance of getting in still. But they're still punks for doing this to you, any way you slice it.
On a similar vein, I applied for another Orem Library Part Time position, mainly because my supervisors kept implying it was a lock if I did. I found out yesterday I didn't get the job. Thanks.
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The fools!! >:( We hates them for you, yes we does!
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Fish, I've been there. I was on the waiting list for a couple of prestigious law schools when I was applying to law school. One told me that they couldn't take me afterall but the other accepted me. However, I didn't find out until a couple of weeks before school started that I was accepted, which happend to be when I had moved from Provo to Logan, UT. So after living in Logan, UT for two days, I moved to Madison, WI (and dropped out of a MA program at Utah State).
I know BYU is ultra-competative and a hard school to turn down but I wouldn't give up hope on you getting in. It sounds like you have a fair shot, even if it takes a while to find out. People do decline acceptances.
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* Nessa sprinkles fairy dust on Fish for good luck.
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Thanks, all.
Parker, that actually does make me feel a little bit better (the
TESOL thing, that is). Sorry about the job. They obviously don't know what's good for them.
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Have you heard from any of the other schools? I know it's frustrating to wait to hear--I'd accepted Simmons by the time that Illinois State finally got around to telling me I was accepted and giving me a TA offer--in mid December, three or four weeks before school started. By then, I'd decided that Simmons was the place I wanted to go. I think if you know the place is right for you, you should give it time and see how it works out.
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I won't be going to UW or SJSU even if they accept me. So it really doesn't matter what they say. Of course, it would be nice to be accepted, but BYU is really the only one that matters at this point.
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Yeah, I was thinking more of the boost of the acceptance. But if you were to get accepted, I'd think it'd be something to think about, of course. I never intended to live in Boston (it was my "safe school," because I intended to go to Illinois State and stay near home), but it was one of the best decisions I ever made.
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I'm really, really sorry, Fish. I'm crossing my fingers and super duper hoping for you.
(They have sent out their letters, BTW.)
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I'm really, really sorry, Fish. I'm crossing my fingers and super duper hoping for you.
(They have sent out their letters, BTW.)
And???????
But if you were to get accepted, I'd think it'd be something to think about, of course.
Except that I can't afford it. Which means I could think about it all I want, but I still can't go. I'm not going $50,000 into debt when I don't ever intend to use the degree to work full time.
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It is better than a total rejection though. Now if you could just get the list of people who applied we can scare at least 8 away. I think thats totally possible.
My ninja monkeys are at your disposal for this task.
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Posted by: McFish Posted on: Today at 12:22am
on Mar 5th, 2006, 8:49pm, stacer wrote:
But if you were to get accepted, I'd think it'd be something to think about, of course.
Except that I can't afford it. Which means I could think about it all I want, but I still can't go. I'm not going $50,000 into debt when I don't ever intend to use the degree to work full time.
You can afford it, you just need to find out how. I made it out of law school with less than $50,000 worth of debt and that when I was paying $25,000 a year in tuition alone. Graduate students seem to do a lot better because they can get TA or RA positions, fellowships, scholarship and host of other help to offset the cost (although I hear that BYU isn't as good at this as other major Universities). But even if the fundign is tight, $50,000 seems like an awful lot for BYU, as I recall, they are still one of the cheapest Universities in the US. If you get accepted, I think you should take some time to figure out if it is financially possible before you cross it off (an MA can still pay off in more ways then you might think).
Anyways, I still hope you get accepted, if for no other reason then for you to have an option.
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She's saying BYU is the only one she can afford. The other two schools are the ones she worries about affording.
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And???????
You did say you wanted more drama. :P ;D
I'm accepted with the provision that I take 12 credit hours of catchup in my first year. Isn't 6 credit hours per semester full-time for grad students?
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6 credits of graduate level classes. For catch up, you'll likely be taking undergrad classes, which aren't nearly as demanding. Still, it'll be a busy first year for you.
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Yeah, with undergrad classes that's barely a full time semester.
Congrats! That makes me soooooo happy!
She's saying BYU is the only one she can afford. The other two schools are the ones she worries about affording.
Right. I can afford BYU. I cannot afford to live in Seattle or San Jose. Period.
And actually, BYU is a lot better at giving grad students teaching positions than other Univeristies. UW says there will be no assistanceships in the first year. Which would mean 20,000 in debt on tuition alone. For a Creative Writing degree. No thank you.
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Also, Lost One, you were going for a J.D. Doctorate level grad programs give out a lot more assistance than Master level programs.
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That's not quite right 42. It is true that doctorate level programs do give out more assistance but not for professional programs such as for a JD or and MD. Law and medical students usually have to live off of loans which is why the average law student graduates with around $90,000 worth of debt and the average medical students has around $200,000. I made it through law school by getting TA positions in the political science department because there were not enough MA and Ph.D. students to fill all of the positions. It depends on the school, but many programs offer significant financial aid (real financial aid, not loans) to help out their master students.
Unfortunately, for someone in the social sciences, humanities, or english, getting grants, fellowships, scholarships, and other such aid is more difficult then if someone is in a science or engineering program (where they seem to throw money at all their graduate students).
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Law and medical students usually have to live off of loans which is why the average...medical student has around $200,000.
I will vouch for this. We were fortunately able to graduate with with less than half that debt because I worked full time as a tech writer, which paid enough for us to live on, plus a little extra.
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Bottom line is:
Creative Writing Degree + Never Intending to Get a 9-5 Job = Stay out of massive debt if you know what's good for you.
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lol. Plain and simple. Makes good sense. Really tough all the same, though, because it's such an important goal you have. So just hang in there.
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So I've been officially rejected. Hooray for me.
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Argh! I'm so sorry to hear that, Fish. :(
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That's too bad, MsFish. I'm sure that a path will open for you, though. You'll figure it out.
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I'm a firm believer that paths don't just open. You beat the door down with a sledge hammer and then the path appears.
Thanks for the support, though.
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If you want, I have a sledgehammer you could borrow. :)
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I'm a firm believer that paths don't just open. You beat the door down with a sledge hammer and then the path appears.
Yes and no. I've had both happen for me. Some things are just out of our control (not saying that's this situation), and some things we are very much in control of, like pursuing our goals (though still having an element of lack of control, like whether a school accepts you or a company hires you).
I say that just to say that what I was trying to say is that if a path you've decided on isn't working, often we find (through our choice and through inspiration) a new path, which sometimes helps us get where we intended, just in a different way. At least, that's my experience. But of course it's different for every person.
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To agree with Stacer, it's best to avoid having an entitlement reaction to these sort of situations. That is just because you work really hard for a specific result, doesn't mean you are entitled to that specific result, especially when those results involve other people's agency. Now often you do get the result you wanted from all of your hard work, but when that isn't the case, it's best to look for alternative outcomes.
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To quote FMA:
"Equivalent Exchange is just a lie used to keep the masses from rioting"
Ie, you should never expect equal gain from equal effort.
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Entitlement reaction?
Wow.
Who was having an entitlement reaction?
I don't think I want to talk to you all anymore.
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I think you're overreacting to the response, Fish. They're just saying that you can take opportunities, but some things are out of your control, no matter what you put in.
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I don't really care what any of you think.
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Actually, that wasn't what I was saying at all. I was just saying that even though this didn't work out, you'll still figure it out. That's all.
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Yeah, I understood what you were saying. And I agree with you. Fully. I was just adding to it with the sledgehammer thing. Thanks for the support, Stacer.
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For future reference, I think when someone has something crappy happen to them (ie not get into a creative writing program because the admissions committee is dumber than bricks)--and they share this crappy experience with you--they're not looking for psychoanalysis. At least, that's not what I'm looking for when I do it.
Fish, I know what you're going through. Nine doctoral program rejections and a severe case of "reanalyze my life and try and figure out what the hell I'm going to do now" give me a strong dose of empathy. I honestly have no clue what BYU's thinking. I've been in their creative writing classes. I've read the work some of their students are spewing writing. And I've read your stuff.
Sigh.
Ever think of library science? ;)
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I personally agree with the whole sledgehammer thing. If God wants to open a window while I'm busy knocking down walls with a sledgehammer, that's fine.
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Exactly. That way if he doesn't, you've got several large holes in the drywall to choose from.
And thank you, Parker. I appreciate your empathy.
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I'm really liking the imagery here. Someone might even relate it to that story (cheesy though it is, it is actually one of those spiritual twinkies that works for me) about how our trials are just God knocking down our old walls. When we protest and say that we liked our cozy little cottage, why did he have to go and knock it down? And he answers that he's remodeling it to a mansion or something.
Like I said, cheesy, but I like the idea that we're a major player in the remodeling. 'Course, that takes it in a completely different direction, I suppose.
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Ive been absent for a few days so the drama just seems more dramatic, but I realized I cant get worked up. MsFish, I had had and will have nothing but utmost confidence in you. You are going to go far whatever temporary setbacks you might have. Plus with an attitude like knocking big holes in the drywall you've definately got the drive to accomplish it. As long as you keep doing that, I will never worry about you. I will however pray that some nice editor realizes how good you book is and says something to the effect of "I must have it, bring me the phone number of this woman!" In a John Lovitts the Actor voice.
Im sorry that things didnt work out the way you wanted them to though. I hope your doing ok.