Author Topic: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain  (Read 1190 times)

swaindaddy

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May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« on: May 12, 2009, 01:13:44 AM »
Post your analysis here for the second 3000 words. Thanks for the all the input so far. It is only making things better!
"People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything."

Wizard's First Rule —Chapter 36, p.397, U.S. hardcover edition

Hamster

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2009, 02:20:13 AM »
This is a superbly done second chapter.

It doesn't let up on action or suspence, but also has great worldbuilding and interesting dialogue and characterization woven into it.

That being said, I think that the dialogue was a little drawn out, as we still aren't firmly established with Garrik's character yet, it seems like we have his viewpoint for a few paragraphs, and then it's gone for half the chapter(it's interesting dialogue, like I said before, but maybe interject some of Garrik's thoughts during the conversation).

I am very intrigued by the drakkin, it seems like a very cool race, even if similar to other fantasy races. So good job with that.

I also liked the boy's assassination on Vorgen, although here come my few scruples for this part of the chapter: Would a top secret organization that controls so much in this world let a small boy sneak his way into their order? And even if their leader was killed, they let the two men they let into their secret entrance, hear their conversation, and then let them escape? I don't see that happening.

The second half of the submission  took a little bit longer to hook me, as I still wanted to be reading about the Gloaming Hand and Garrik w/ Dren. But after a little bit, I got into it, and I enoyed Karrys's character as well. the ending of the chapter was a good setup/cliff hanger, and even if it is a bit cliche, I loved the "A storm is coming" line.

Great job so far

However,

swaindaddy

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2009, 03:45:54 AM »
My goal is for this to be a "familiar but atypical" fantasy book. I want the world to be failry familiar but the writing style to be much faster paced. as a result of that I don't spend too much time on the characters. We will learn more of them as the story rolls but I definately get your point on that and will work on it.

I absolutely need to tighten up the dialogue. This is actually all part of chapter 1 (including last weeks submission and next weeks.) So, once the entire chapter is in, it may seem a bit more cohesive.

My ploy is too interupt Garrik and Dren precisely at the moment the reader wants to know more. Bait and switch. I may need to move the Dukes Chamber farther in but, as you will see next week, It is integral.

Thanks for the input - all elements will help as I edit!!! Keep it coming.
"People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything."

Wizard's First Rule —Chapter 36, p.397, U.S. hardcover edition

RavenstarRHJF

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2009, 03:10:01 AM »
Ok, wow.  First you present the Gloaming Hand as horrible, implacable tyrants, and now they almost seem like the good guys!  At least, that's the vibe I got off the page while reading.  I didn't particularly mind, though, other than it appears to be an aboutface- but not necessarily one that can't be explained! ;D

It did strike me as odd that Garrik and Dren got away so easily.  At the very least, they should have met the man on guard in the passageway  on their way out.

On the whole, I think chapter 2 worked better than chapter 3, but that's probably because we were already introduced to the characters.

As introduction to new characters and new plot lines, chapter 3 worked well, though.  A minor point: why would anyone be reading in the Duke's anteroom?  Reading would probably be done in a library or study, but an anteroom?  Anterooms are for people waiting on the convenience of someone in authority- they probably wouldn't expect to wait long, and even if they did, they probably wouldn't bring reading material with them.  Yes, it was an effective way to tell us that the lighting was dim, but it was a little out there.  Just my opinion, though.

I liked how you set up the revelation of the King's message in Chapter 2. ;)

Really looking forward to more!
A crown does not a King make, nor the lack of one a commoner.

Renoard

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2009, 01:09:02 PM »
This story is shaping up to be entertaining, and you have salted enough allusion and foreshadowing to keep you very busy story-telling for several volumes.  I am starting to warm to the Garrik but the other boy is a bit of blank.  Karrys is another sympathetic character.  Some of your asides in the first submission, suggest that the boys might have been slumming so there may be potential to see him interacting with the Duchess.

I saw a number of structural issues that arise from characterization, setting and use of language.
First, the "fast pace" may be an experiment, but I think it might actually be getting in your way.  It's a good sort of thing for a guiding rule, but such rules shouldn't become so rigidly applied that they hamper you.  If you sacrifice too much character building the story telling will suffer and the fast pace will never have it's audience.

In the previous submission, the terrible Hand looks like an organized crime syndicate, then suddenly they are patriots engaging in Kingmaking.  It's a jolt.  And the only reason I can see for a group like this to let the boys see their faces, hear the plot to assassinate the King, watch the Drakkin assassinated, and escape is if it was all a staged performance.  That would presuppose that the Hand knew in advance the boys would get caught, run into their territory, hide in just the right building and that it would all happen on schedule.  It's pretty thin, but even if you intend that as the plot, then it begs the question why the Hand want to be the target of a manhunt by the Talonguard, and why they want a war with the Drakkin.  Far too convoluted and otherwise it just doesn't make sense.

Quote
Let us not forget though that the Neutral City sits at the center of this heightened conflict. Prudence would prove wise
Prudence is at minimum a closely related concept to wisdom so this reads as, "wisdom would be wise."  I know it's more of a catch it later issue, but it interrupted me reading.

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“Sarikk, I wish the drakkin hadn’t left this city decades ago.
The phrase "decades ago" is too specific and not specific enough.  The way it stands it sounds lecturely and pedantic.

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Eight large high back chairs lined each side of the anteroom stationed in small groupings around sturdy oak tables.
I'm just not comfortable with a keep having wooden floors, or with one Royal, keeping another Royal of equal rank, waiting in an anteroom.  The floors compound this problem, as Chule is obviously the poor country cousin.

Quote
Sergeant Jora Je’Thelras, the King’s niece.
The king's niece is a potential heir or at minimum the potential mother of a potential heir.  As a royal, it seems unlikely that if she were allowed to take up arms she would be given a rank of knighthood instead of command.
For that matter a Duke or a Duchess is a prince, a royal and, technically, a King (or queen) who has sworn fealty to another King.  It seems far more likely that the written message would have been simple stuff and even lies, to throw off anyone who managed to sneak a peek.  The only logical reason for a Royal to carry a message, is if the real message were in her pointy little head.
Now it's your story and your plot, but that's the hurdle you face in convincing me that this made sense.

Quote
His mouth was wide and dual canines protruded from his lower lip, each two inches in length.
Not sure, do you mean dual as in two on each side?  So four tusks then.

Quote
Long ears, sharp nose, and tiny eyes adorned a thin ragged Duke Chule.
This phrasing left me wondering at first if a Duke Chule was a style of facial hair I needed to know to read the chapter.

Quote
But why not inform her? She would have argued and tried to avoid the assignment, she knew.
I assume the tersity here is in the interest of avoiding wordiness, but some segue is needed to go from wondering why to answering her own question. Maybe rephrase for clarity.

On a positive note:

Quote
Thunder boomed across the sky in the distance. A storm was coming.
This works nicely, though it might work even better separated into a new paragraph.

I'm looking forward to the next block of this "chapter"?  It's intriguing.  If told a little too sparsely. ;P
You can always get what you want if you never count the cost.

swaindaddy

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2009, 04:27:12 PM »
Very good points all Reonard. Very helpful. I am gaininga  wealth of knowledge as to how to meka this book better already! Your valuable insight is exactly what I came here looking for. Thanks for the time.

I think you are catching the thinness of my rough first draft and helping me know where to make it firm and make it make sense.

More to come.
"People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything."

Wizard's First Rule —Chapter 36, p.397, U.S. hardcover edition

swaindaddy

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2009, 04:29:49 PM »
Ok, wow.  First you present the Gloaming Hand as horrible, implacable tyrants, and now they almost seem like the good guys!  At least, that's the vibe I got off the page while reading.  I didn't particularly mind, though, other than it appears to be an aboutface- but not necessarily one that can't be explained! ;D

It did strike me as odd that Garrik and Dren got away so easily.  At the very least, they should have met the man on guard in the passageway  on their way out.

On the whole, I think chapter 2 worked better than chapter 3, but that's probably because we were already introduced to the characters.

As introduction to new characters and new plot lines, chapter 3 worked well, though.  A minor point: why would anyone be reading in the Duke's anteroom?  Reading would probably be done in a library or study, but an anteroom?  Anterooms are for people waiting on the convenience of someone in authority- they probably wouldn't expect to wait long, and even if they did, they probably wouldn't bring reading material with them.  Yes, it was an effective way to tell us that the lighting was dim, but it was a little out there.  Just my opinion, though.

I liked how you set up the revelation of the King's message in Chapter 2. ;)

Really looking forward to more!

I am seeing that I need to work on The Gloaming Hand more - but as you will find in future chapters they are not the evil group everyone thinks but I want to keep the reader wondering for a while yet as to who they really are. I also look forward to integrating changes so that I can make the chapters clearer - keep the input coming!!!
"People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything."

Wizard's First Rule —Chapter 36, p.397, U.S. hardcover edition

Silk

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Re: May 11 -Blade of the Fallen Chapter 2 - Chris Swain
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2009, 09:04:28 AM »
And for the second installment of Silk's HDC (horridly delayed critiques):

"Rather than a nose the drakkin had two rounded nostrils that reminded Garrik of those he had seen on a Telebon asp."

If "Telebon asp" was mentioned somewhere in the first chapter, I don't remember it. This comparison doesn't mean anything to me.

Why does this Hand bring two kids who broke  into his house to what looks to be an important  meeting of the Hand? Doesn't make sense. And again... it feels kind of infodumpy.

The fact that Dren and Garrick so conveniently escaped the Hand makes me wonder what the purpose of the meeting was (aside from making me question the plausibility of the situation, which it did a little). If it was only so that we could see the Hand's meeting and maybe meet the Hand characters, surely there's another way to give us access to that information.

Unless there's something I've missed, it takes about three pages for you to tell us that Karrys is the Duchess after she makes her opinion, long enough that I was a bit jolted to discover that she WAS the duchess. Slipping that information in earlier might not be a bad idea. (If Karrys IS the Duchess; I'm actually not quite clear on that at this point.)

I think that this scene with the King's decree came at just the right time, though. Not that things were slow before, but now we have a hint of the larger conflict coming up. Good job.