Author Topic: Adios Iraq  (Read 13145 times)

The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #45 on: March 19, 2003, 07:44:26 PM »
Spriggan, frequently I can't understand what you're trying to say.

However, as for being opposed to war, if we really found stuff, I'd certainly admit I was wrong in my opposition ON THAT COUNT. I wouldn't apologize, however. Why would I owe an apology? And to whom?

I would still believe it was probably wrong due to the morality of messing with other governments, as Fell keeps pointing out.

Again, I'm not sure what you're saying, but it seems like your last post is justifying invading other countries on the basis that we're capable of doing it with more or less impunity. That sounds very, very frightening to me. Please tell me I misunderstood.

As a further side-note, I find it extemely unlikely that we'll be greeted whole-heartedly as liberators. According to the Washington Post, Most Iraqi ammo/firearms dealers are very low on supplies because the citizens of Baghdad are buying them up. The Post makes a big deal about how they're doing it to combat rioters/looters, but also admits that these citizens state they're doing it to fight US soldiers. Granted, it's my opinion they'd just as soon shoot an Iraqi soldier who tries to break down their door, but they still don't want to see us running their country. The Iraqis have been told for many, many years that the U.S. is evil and wants to destroy their religion and their society. Sure, it's a lie, but that doesn't mean it hasn't been absorbed. And it'd be hard to believe that the people who've been bombing your home for the last dozen years are doing it to set you free.

Fellfrosch

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2003, 08:02:22 PM »
True, Spriggan: at this point there's little we can do other than wait and see what happens. I highly doubt that we'll begin an age of rampant imperialism. Bush Jr. is the first president to offer a well-formed description of America's international policy in a post-Cold-War environment, and I want to see how it plays out--invading Iraq, it should be noted, is only a small portion of that plan.
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Mr_Pleasington

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2003, 08:48:12 PM »
Well the bum rush is about to begin and I must say that I'm behind our troops 100%.  We've painted ourselves in a corner here and it's obvious that war is all but inevitable now.  Initially I was opposed to the war, but something has to be done about Saddam and apparently we're not too hot on diplomacy these days.  

Isn't Nicadymus over there?

I just read that we most likely have EMP bombs now, which is certainly interesting.  I guess we'll finally see all the gadgets the military has been secretly developing in the last decade or so.



Spriggan

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2003, 09:59:06 PM »
Nicadymus is in the reserves so I guess he would be.  He's one of my childhood friends and I don't even know  :-/.
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House of Mustard

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #49 on: March 20, 2003, 03:57:09 AM »
I don't think that the precedent that Bush is setting is as terrifying as some here seem to think.  I also don't know where all of you kids have been for the last eighteen months, but that precedent (invading a country with the intention of regime change based on evidence of state-sponsored terrorism and human rights violations) was set pretty handily back in scenic Afghanistan.

The US has been a major fan of regime change for a century.  Sometimes it works, and sometimes it backfires miserably (ousting the shah in Iran to put in the Ayat Allah?  Nice move.)

Anyway, the point is that the precedent was set long ago, and invading Iraq today and maybe North Korea tomorrow is not a big step toward much of anything.

There is a technical difference, I admit, between handing out buckets of guns to the Contras or the Northern Alliance, and invading with three fourths of our entire military.  I would argue, however, that the difference is negligible.

In the first case, we induce a regime change by supplying guns and special forces and money, and everybody knows that the US just changed the leadership of Nicaragua - or - we charge in and shoot up the place, and everybody knows that we changed the leadership of Nicaragua.  Whether it's with our own boys, or the local opposition parties, the effect is the same - regime change with US influence at the cost of some bloodshed and a lot of money.

So what is the disturbing precedent?  That now it's our boys in uniform?  It's unfortunate, but probably fewer will die in the attempt.


Anyway - it's 1:00 in the morning and I'm glued to the TV.  A couple of Iraqi units have already showed up at the Kuwaiti border with white flags.  Lets all pray that it's a sign of things to come.
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Fellfrosch

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #50 on: March 20, 2003, 12:15:33 PM »
Skar was over there for a while, but he was supposed to come back in February--is he back? Was his tour extended?

I didn't watch the war coverage last night, I played an FPS. How's that for surreal?
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House of Mustard

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #51 on: March 20, 2003, 12:50:04 PM »
By the way Fell, I forgot to mention something: You're a dirty communist.
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Fellfrosch

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #52 on: March 20, 2003, 12:59:00 PM »
Big talk, Australopithecus Jones.
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Entsuropi

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #53 on: March 23, 2003, 08:01:05 AM »
OK. so here is something i do not understand. just wtf is Saddam doing? He knows the coalition will capture baghdad within 3/4 days. so, what is his plan?

Seeing as how we are all RPers here, lets see if we can't figure this out from his perspective. I would have thought he would be running by now.
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Fellfrosch

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #54 on: March 23, 2003, 09:35:51 AM »
Frankly, if he were a CoC character, he'd have insanity points coming out his ears. He probably knows he can't touch us with military might, so he's not even trying. Instead he hopes that intl sympathy will extend to condeming the US. Unlikely, because what would the UN do against the US? I mean, I wouldn't want to fight a war with Russia and China, but even as a UN coalition, does anyone have the cahoneys to do that over *IRAQ*? it's not an issue anyone feels is worth the risk, even if they DID feel that passionate about it, and the French have already shown they don't feel it. So yeah, Hussein just doesn't understand all the factors. It's like he's playing risk and he doesn't understand that holding continents gets you more troops. (how's that for two game analogies in one on-the-fly answer?

Entsuropi

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #55 on: March 23, 2003, 01:13:09 PM »
Quote
"The United Nations should pass a resolution prohibiting the sun from rising while they are at it." - A Freeper's response to Jacques Chirac's declaration that he will use the French veto to force the UN to oppose any post-war administration of Iraq by Britain and America
If you're ever in an argument and Entropy winds up looking staid and temperate in comparison, it might be time to cut your losses and start a new thread about something else :)

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #56 on: March 25, 2003, 05:42:04 PM »
Nicadymus is at boot camp atm, not in Iraq.  I talked with a friend and found this out.  Just FYI sence he's a TWGr
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Entsuropi

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #57 on: April 09, 2003, 07:16:13 PM »
If you're ever in an argument and Entropy winds up looking staid and temperate in comparison, it might be time to cut your losses and start a new thread about something else :)

Fellfrosch

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #58 on: April 09, 2003, 07:47:04 PM »
Well, we can only hope this kind of sentiment spreads. It will alleviate the tensions that inevitably build to terrorism.
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Spriggan

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Re: Adios Iraq
« Reply #59 on: April 09, 2003, 10:28:22 PM »
I'm going to have to fins an article on the subject but the news channels have been reporting a bunch of Iraqis have been vocaly criticizing Al-jezera and arab media for being pro-sadam
Screw it, I'm buying crayons and paper. I can imagineer my own adventures! Wheeee!

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