So am I wrong here?

[Spriggan]

I had to but my foot down today, and I probaly look like a villian to my roomates.  Before I can say what I did, let me give a little background.


I came back from Chirstmass vacation this year to find I had a new roommate.  One of 42 and Promethious' friends got kicked out of his aparment due to a stupid new law in Provo, so 42 offererd to let him stay with us for a few weeks until he finds a new place.  After about 2 weeks he decides to move back to Idaho, where he's originaly from, and live with his parents.  I thought this sucked becaue he was someone that both my roomates liked to do things with.

Come a week later and he's still here, turns out he's been sick and didn't want to move, fair enough.  A few more days pass and nothing, I find out he's decided to stay in Utah despite haveing no job nor going to school (he dropped out a while ago).  Ok I thought, but he doesn't have a job, nor is he a student so no one is going to rent to him even thought his parents send him money every few weeks.

By this time 42's decided to help him get a job, something he didn't seam very enthusiastic about.  See, from what I've been told, he hasn't had a job in about 8 months and has been liveing off his parents and now, as I see it, me and 42.  Instead of finding a job so he can get a new aparment he's been playing my videogames on my TV, watching my DVDs on my DVD player, and liveing on my couch.  He's got it good.  42 doesn't charge him that much rent becasue, well, 42 is a nice guy.  

So after 2 months I've determened that this person has no intention of doing anything to better his situation or his live.  42 has tried to, in his passive agressive manner, help him get a job and realise he needs to do something.  So after talking it over with EUOL, tage, Fell, and 42 I decided today that I would no longer allow him to use any of my things until he gets a job.  This means no TV, no DVDs, no couch, microwave ect.  It's harsh, I didn't want to have to do it, but I see it as the only way things are going to change in the sitation.  It was about all I can do too, 42 is the leaser and I would never ask him to kick the guy out, that's not the right thing to do.

So I ask you all, am I wrong on what I just did?  I don't thinks so, someone needed to do something and didn't want to put 42 in a overly uncomfortable position by makeing a huge scene.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

I'm with you. something needs to be done. I'd have booted him, or at least insisted he start paying an equal share of rent.

[Spriggan]

I think 42 is going to start asking him to pay an equal part, though it's not that much maybe around $200, but I didn't want to speak for 42 in this post since I know he has a different perspective then me.

Also I'd like to add that he's not a jerk or a bad person, quite the opposite, he's just someone who's done nothing with his life for the past half a year and, for many reasons, gotten too comfortable with the situation he's in now.   And while I think he has the intention of trying to get a job and his own place, he's not doing it becasue there's no reason or pressure for him to do so.

[Tekiel]

I had a similar problem with some roommates of mine once.  I was in charge of the phone/internet bill and all my roomies got the internet from hooking up their computers to my computer (ask Tage what I mean, he set it all up).  Anyway, one roommate was continually late on her bill, often paying just before the next one would arrive.  I wouldn't have minded as much, but she would constantly go shopping and spend all of her paychecks before the week was out.  So, I found a way to disconnect her from the internet without disconnecting myself.  You can bet, I never got many late bills from her after that.  

We never had a big fight or anything, she just needed a way to make this bill one of the priorities in her life.  I think you're doing the right thing.

[Skar]

Well done Spriggan.

[GorgonlaVacaTremendo]

I would have booted the freeloader, personally, but I agree with what you are doing.  How are you enforcing it if the guy doesn't have a job or school and you do?  I mean, he'll be home all the time while you wont be...

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

Im not sure why your asking for validation on this Sprig, do you feel guilty about it?

[EUOL]

I think you're walking a nice line here, Sprig.  When I've talked to you, you haven't been annoyed at this person specifically--you think he's a nice enough fellow--but you are annoyed that because he lives in your living room, you don't have access to your television or entertainment system.  

However, to make this work, you're going to need to take your things and move them into your room.  I think your room is big enough.  Realize what you're saying is "This guy can stay, but we have to treat him like a true roommate--with his own bedroom and things, and with him paying full rent."  Then, you take that living room as 'his' room, and you move all of your stuff into your room.  It's not harsh or mean--it's just the way people live.  When you moved in, you didn't go put your big-screen TV or audio system in 42's bedroom.  You put it where you could use it.

If you need help moving, let me know, and I'll come over tomorrow morning.

[MsFish]

What EUOL is suggesting may be a good idea, but it would drive me insane.  I had a roommate effectively move out of her bedroom and into the living room this summer, and I nearly hurt her.  Common space should be common space, I think.  But then, I'm sure this situation is different than mine was.

[42]

Okay, I guess I'll chime in.
The guy is my friend and has been for some time. Which puts me in an uncomfortable position. I was happy to help him out when he got kicked out of his place in Provo because Provo finally decided to enforce a law they haven't enforced in years.

The first week or so, he seemed rather motivated to find a new place, but most everything was outside of his budget or refused to rent to someone unemployed.

The job hunt has not gone well. My thought is that he simply doesn't know how to go about getting a job. Having read some of his applications, they are not a professional as they should be. So he's applied places but isn't getting interviewed. And he did get ill and is ill again.

Last month I charged him for rent and TV, but it was only half rent because he was only here half the month (well a little longer). This month I will probably charge him full rent.

I guess it doesn't bother me, having him in the living room, like it does Spriggan. Course, I grew up in a family of ten where having my own space and things was just unrealistic. Yet, I see Spriggan's point. The apartment just isn't big enough for a forth roommate and all of our stuff in a long term situation.

I think what I need to do is to get him to set some plans and give me some definite deadlines as to when he will have found a place and when he will move out.

Just don't start a war with him, Sprig. I don't want to have to choose between keeping him or you.

[EUOL]

Just don't start a war with him, Sprig. I don't want to have to choose between keeping him or you.

Hum.  This seems a rather blunt way of putting things, 42, but perhaps you had to say it.  It's in everyone's best interest to keep the peace.  Still (and realize that I'm not aware of the situation of Sprig and Pro moving in with you)  despite the lease being in your name, I find this comment to be a bit authoritarian.

I see living as roommates--especially roommates who are friends--to be a communal agreement, despite who has charge of the place.  Personally, I think that you're all insane for putting up with a person moving into the living room.  Had you done this, I would have moved out.  It would have seemed a breach of the informal contract between us.  I pay a certain amount, I receive certain things--one of those being a communal living space.

I realize that Sprig and Pro probably agreed to this arrangement, and I think they are being very patient with you and your friend.  (Far more than I would be.)  If Sprig wants to move his things out and let Dan have his place in the front room--in exchange for decreased rent--I see this as a good compromise to a situation that has placed all of you (you especially, 42) in a difficult situation.  

However, if you end up 'throwing out' Sprig (a person with a job, and who has been a steady roommate for many months) because he has a problem with a guy spending months sleeping in the living room (a guy who has no job, and no real prior claim on the apartment) then I would be inclined to question your judgement.

[42]

I just fail to see how I'm being victemized by being a little inconvenienced. I thought I was doing something charitable, especially since there are no homeless shelters in Utah county.

So I'm trying to see what great crime my friend has commited. He's willing to pay rent, and has paid it, which makes the apartment cheaper for everyone, but we do lose out on a few luxuries.

I don't feel abused and I'm happy to share what I have with others. This kind of service just isn't unusual for me. My parents have taken in friends of my siblings for extended stays (think months). They are also storing some of my friend's stuff for him. My grandparents took in a drunk/drug-addicted native american boy for almost three years.

The message that I'm getting from Sprig, and some others on the board, is that he is tired of sharing. That's kind of discouraging.

Sprig is right that my friend need to become more motivated to find a different place to stay and find a job. But picking on him isn't going to encourage him to better his life. He's a good guy, he's mostly discouraged right now. I don't feel that making his life more difficult is going to help him out. (not that I disagree with taking the TV away from him). But maybe I'm wrong.

[stacer]

42, I don't think that they're tired of "sharing" so much as they're tired of not having their apartment be their apartment. I've already talked to you privately about this, but if it were me, I'd be feeling the same way after an extended stay. It's one thing to want to help a friend, but it's still rough to have to juggle someone's private space being the apartment's common area.

[42]

Yes, I get it. I don't agree entirely, but I get it.
Something will have to be done soon, I guess.

[42]

So I asked him to see if he can get a contract somewhere by Tuesday. He's willing, I think.

If he doesn't have a contract by tuesday, then we have to find someplace else for him by the end of the week.