Timewaster's Guide Archive

I've suggested that metalminds store information on the quantum level and that Ruin is able to alter information stored in them by flipping quantum bits.

If Ruin can alter information stored in a metalmind, can he alter other attributes stored in metalminds as well?

Are you trying to suggest that Ruin could somehow pervert or change things like speed or weight or healing or age?  Perhaps make it so that instead of youth, you get aging, or instead of weight, you get---something else?

Are you suggesting that this relates to the other odd properties of Hemalurgy?  Like the fact that Inquisitors stay alive with huge spikes through their heads?  If the hemalurgy is keeping them alive, if Ruin perverted the "life-support system", perhaps he could pervert their thoughts and emotions via the same system that keeps them alive.

Oh, and incidentally, if we are talking about flipping bits at the quantum level, we had better be talking about the physics in the world as we know it right now, plus magic.  This means electricity would work in Mistborn exactly as at present in our world.  It's not like this would be a stretch for fantasy genres; even Tolkein attempted to connect his fantasy world to the "real world."

It was Ookla's post that triggered my saying this, but doesn't the tone of the bumps seem to be a bit off for it to be Rashek?  I mean, the person is talking about not using the power, about being careful and cautious and studying it before doing anything drastic.  If TLR felt that way about the power, then how on Earth did the Mistborn world end up the mess it is was in for 1000 years, which just seems to be getting worse?

Clearly it is going to be explained.  I'm just saying that in my mind it raises more questions than it answers.

Quote from: happyman on September 29, 2008, 08:09:51 PM

Quote from: elmandr1 on September 29, 2008, 03:58:34 PM

Quote from: GreenMonsta on September 29, 2008, 01:18:32 PM

You know I don't have my book handy but I was almost positive that the quote was "anything not in steel can't be trusted".

You said you read it in the book so I'll take your word on it, it seems to change things a little for me.

The question I have is why would the plate be of Iron and not Steel. What does it matter anyway? Metal is metal. Yes they all do different things allomanticaly but the inquisitors are like mistborn and have use of all metal. Maybe in Hemalurgy it matters what kind of metal is piercing you to allow certain effects. Other than that I don't see what it would matter what kind of metal the plates covering the spikes would be made of.

lol.

Actaully its, "i write this in steel, because anything not in metal can't be trusted..."

so that's why i'm confused...

did he think all metals could resist the Ruin but it turns out that steel is an exception....?

he's wrote it in steel, but said METAL could be trusted...?

i think that he is on to something but its hard to tell for sure.

What he is saying is quite simple, actually.

Anything not written in metal cannot be trusted.

Thus if a source is to be considered trustworthy, it must at a bare minimum be written in metal.

Steel is a metal.  Thus if his record is written in steel, it is possible that it is trustworthy.  By his logic, the same would go for records written in gold or aluminum, but apparently he chose steel.  Maybe it was all he had.  Or maybe there is more logic that we haven't seen.  But based on what he wrote, it seems that he chose steel simply because it was a metal.

That's all those lines mean really.  No need to complicate matters.

Then how do you explain the Ruins hold over the STEEL inquisters?

DURRRR....it is complicated--Sanderson made sure of that.

First of all, that wasn't theorizing on my part.  I was simply parsing the logic in Kwaan's inscription because there seemed to be some confusion about what he was saying.  If there is anything in the book that contradicts his logic, that takes precedence.

You bring up a good point, though.  Maybe he controls the steel inquisitors by creating electric current in the metal going through their brain (of course, this brings up the point:  how do they survive with steel spikes inside their brains)?  Electric current is much, much easier to create and change, from an energetic standpoint, than the bulk atomic structure of a metal.  It is perfectly reasonable that Ruin can  modify the currents in the metals, and in turn control the inquisitors, without being able to control human thought (no easy access with not metal in their heads!) or change the bulk properties of metals. 

Quote from: GreenMonsta on September 29, 2008, 01:18:32 PM

You know I don't have my book handy but I was almost positive that the quote was "anything not in steel can't be trusted".

You said you read it in the book so I'll take your word on it, it seems to change things a little for me.

The question I have is why would the plate be of Iron and not Steel. What does it matter anyway? Metal is metal. Yes they all do different things allomanticaly but the inquisitors are like mistborn and have use of all metal. Maybe in Hemalurgy it matters what kind of metal is piercing you to allow certain effects. Other than that I don't see what it would matter what kind of metal the plates covering the spikes would be made of.

lol.

Actaully its, "i write this in steel, because anything not in metal can't be trusted..."

so that's why i'm confused...

did he think all metals could resist the Ruin but it turns out that steel is an exception....?

he's wrote it in steel, but said METAL could be trusted...?

i think that he is on to something but its hard to tell for sure.

What he is saying is quite simple, actually.

Anything not written in metal cannot be trusted.

Thus if a source is to be considered trustworthy, it must at a bare minimum be written in metal.

Steel is a metal.  Thus if his record is written in steel, it is possible that it is trustworthy.  By his logic, the same would go for records written in gold or aluminum, but apparently he chose steel.  Maybe it was all he had.  Or maybe there is more logic that we haven't seen.  But based on what he wrote, it seems that he chose steel simply because it was a metal.

That's all those lines mean really.  No need to complicate matters.

On topic:  the OP has a point.  If the coins were point particles, and two people were pushing straight out on them, the coin would have to be exactly between them in order to stay still.  Otherwise it would accelerate sideways from the massive pushes, probably beaning some unfortunate passer-by.

However, I suspect that even the basic mistborn or mistings have slightly more control than that.  The coins are not point particles, but are extended bodies, and by pushing or pulling harder on one side than the other, more control is possible, although it probably takes experience.  Maybe this is why pushing matches are so hard.

But for the stars to be visible, wouldn't the mists have to disappear?  And wouldn't that affect Allomancy?  I hope the book doesn't end with Allomancy being destroyed and all the former Allomancers being regular people again.

I've been searching for an hour now, and I can't find it.  Somewhere I believe there was a quote from Brandon saying that the magic systems would change drastically at the end of book 3.  I got the distinct impression that they would still work, but that it would take more effort/something would have to change about how you accessed the power.

I think it's possible that he swallows it before a fight, because stomach acid doesn't dissolve it THAT quickly.  After all, Vin pukes her unused bead up again that one time.

However, I'm leaning toward the idea that Zane does not need to swallow atium, because there's that whole thing about Straff thinking he can control Zane if he bribes him with atium, thinking that all Mistborn are addicted to the stuff, and Zane knowing that he doesn't need the atium Straff gives him.  Now this could be because Zane has another source of atium, other than his father, but it could also be that he just doesn't need it.

He says outright in his viewpoint that the reason he doesn't need it from Straff is because he stockpiled it himself.  Unless he was suppressing memories when he thinks this, he has to swallow atium just like everybody else.

Agreed, just attempting to slow the pace a little with some humor.

Humor?  Sir, I must most assuredly inform you that there is nothing funny about who we select to be the Hero of Ages.  Indeed, a most dignified and restrained discussion, focused on the current difficulties at hand and ignoring irrelevancies, is imperative to surmounting our current difficulties in order to not simply overcome those obstacles which beset us at every hand, but indeed to become stronger and thrive, enjoying our new world in peace and prosperity and preparing it for those who will be lucky enough to follow in our footsteps in the fullness of time.

In such circumstances, all discussions must be focused and to the point.  It would, for instance, be totally inappropriate to allege that Chaos2651 likes to lick baby frogs, even if one had evidence to support such a ghastly, heinous pastime, such as accidentally seeing him do it while perambulating unobserved amongst foliage, and all considerations of how he would use the power given this odd fetish are irrelevant.   Similarly, one would be advised to suppress the fact that Andrew the Great noisily chews his ice after finishing a cup of water, no matter how much one would avoid having an eternity filled with the sound of mandatory loud ice-chewing.

Thus, dear Sir, I cannot say how deeply I am offended that you think any of this is funny.  Contrary to my name, I am a most serious person.