article: Little Girls

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

reference: http://www.timewastersguide.com/view.php?id=1253

[Nessa]

Very funny.   My daughter got into the Princess the the Pauper craze while it was still hot. Now it's Barbie and the Magic of Pegasus. She doesn't much care for the speculative fiction side of things unless it involves unicorns and flying horses. She's very mainstream. *sigh*

[Brenna]

I don't think liking role playing and action fantasy/ sci-fi is a learned behavior for girls, so there.  

My sisters and I often played make believe when we were little. My youngest sister was always a gypsy girl, my other sister was a runaway princess, and I was a reformed assassin (I had all the cool fighting/killing skills without the moral issues that way, I guess) who owned an inn that was always used as the base of operations.

I think the first movie my mom took me to was a Star Wars movie, though.

I think it just helps to have both parents like gaming and speculative fiction.  Brenna's been inundated with such things since birth, after all.  She's been to three movies in the theater--the newest Harry Potter, Chronicles of Narnia, and King Kong.  Her favorite toy to chew on is a little green plush dragon with a rattle inside.

One of her favorite activities is actually sitting on Chris's lap as he plays World of Warcraft. She likes when he jumps or kills monsters.

Granted, she's not even four months old yet, so she may turn into a sparkly princess type yet, but I was always more interested in fighting bad guys when I was little...

Oh, and I liked your article. 'Twas a fun read! Good luck on bringing your children over to the geeky side.  

[Spriggan]

Glad you got something done SE, sorry for flaking out on you with this project but I had to deal with that problem.

[House of Mustard]

See, I'm the opposite.  I actively try to get my daughter to like girl stuff.  It's because of my deep, painful shame.

[MsFish]

I don't think liking role playing and action fantasy/ sci-fi is a learned behavior for girls, so there.  

Don't burst his bubble.  The realization that his kids are girlie girls and not gamer girls might send him into shock.  

[Oldie Black Witch]

Great article, SE.

Meanwhile, I have three boys. One is asking if I'm a robot, one makes inter-galactic ships out of Legos, and the youngest amuses himself reading books. The two oldest (7 and 6 years old) are big into CCGs right now.

It makes a mom proud.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

Sorry, Brenna. You have not convinced me that this isn't trained behavior.

To be fair, it's my wife's fault. She's actively working against me, I think.

[Fellfrosch]

It's kind of funny, Brenna, that you claim geekdom is not a learned trait, and then follow up with evidence that your parents raised you in a geek environment. That would seem to support the "learned" hypothesis.

[Ruthie]

I was just like your daughters as a kid, Saint E. I pretended to be a princess pretty much 24/7, played with Barbies a lot, watched Disney movies and dreamed of becoming a mermaid, and played house and dress up.

My dad spent years trying to convince me to read Ender's Game, and my response was always, "But I don't like science fiction."

Then I read it (in eleventh grade; I was developmentally delayed, I guess). And I started reading a lot of other sf and fantasy. I'm still not a "gamer girl" in any sense of the word (I don't like video games or RPGs or Magic, but I do enjoy a good game of Catan or Scrabble). However, I am a sf/fantasy writer and nerd. There is still hope for your daughters.

That is, if you consider my "transformation" severe enough to be hope inspiring.

[stacer]

I've never been a gamer girl, but I wasn't your typical princess girl either. I did daydream of that, but my main daydreams at ages 6-9 were of being either Japanese or the child of the Dukes of Hazzard. But I still would argue that there's a very good thing about letting girls have that princess daydream, which I think--if handled well--helps develop a good sense of self (I hate the term "self-esteem") if *balanced* with other interests. The idea that a girl is a princess to her family is one that I like, if the definition of a princess is highly-valued and loved, rather than spoiled and pampered.

[Kogarashi]

I'd have to say it's learned, but there's still hope for your girls.  When I was younger, I'd play with Barbies (my two poor G.I.Joes got to be "sons" because no one made teenage boy Barbies in those days), watch Disney movies, want to be a princess, and play make-believe where I was a princess and could cast magic spells.  Admittedly, right after playing with Barbies I'd run outside and climb trees, but still....

In middle school, I liked to read any suspense/horror/ghost/etc. books I could find (like Joan Lowry Nixon's work).  It wasn't until eight grade, when the teacher had us read The Hobbit and I discovered an Anne McCaffrey short story in our textbook, that I was actively introduced to the wonderful world of speculative fiction.  My parents aren't geeks, and none of my sisters have really followed in my footsteps, but now I roleplay with a passion and am the one who owns the video game systems.

So anyway.  There's hope yet.

[Brenna]

Well, I mostly commented in the first place because of this:

"Right now the dozen or so regulars on TWG who are girls are planning how they'll object in the forum thread for this article. This is a good thing, as it increases our page hit counts. "


In other words, I was trying to be funny.

And at any rate, as I read it the article didn't say that geekiness itself was learned, just that "action" type stuff, and roleplaying, etc. was a learned behavior. After all, pretending to be a princess or liking magic girl anime is still fantasy.

I chose to do roleplaying on my own, though--my mom's still convinced that roleplaying is evil, in fact.  And though I had a wide range of books to choose from, both mainstream and genre, my favorites for a long time tended toward the post-apocalyptic and the military sci-fi.  So there.

[Nessa]

the dozen or so regulars on TWG who are girls

Um, girls? I'm hardly a girl. I've given birth three times. I think I deserve more respect than that.  

[stacer]

This is where Mormon culture comes back into play. You're not a woman till you're married and have kids. Therefore, really, the only girls still on here are me and MsFish and Chimera, and I'm probably older than all of the mothers/wives on here. It's an interesting cultural phenomenon. (I'm not taking offense, just observing. I still refer to myself as a girl.)