Timewaster's Guide Archive
Games => Role-Playing Games => Topic started by: Mad Dr Jeffe on October 07, 2003, 10:43:50 AM
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Its called HARP and its designed to lure D&D players back to ICE games. I presume this means it will take advantage of new layout design and other things.
the promo PDF can be founf here http://www.ironcrown.com/free_downloads/ICESellSheet3000Harp.pdf
A BBS thread overview of the system can be found here.
http://www.ironcrown.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1538
Im not crazy about ICE, but it bears some looking into.
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Now while im not Crazy about Rule Master and MERP ICE's games always had one section that was good for a laugh.
The legendary critical hit tables!
The tables had rules for critical fumbles and successes with every weapon type (like when you accidentally shoot a crossbow bolt through your foot, or lance your opponent through the eardrums [removing all earwax])
and they were immensely fun.
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Just FYI, ICE was the first game publisher to link TWG. It's in their link page under RPG General Resource sites, it was put up last december. Not sure if they ever sent us anything (if they have, Kid got it) so maybe we can get a copy.
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I'll get together with Fell over what to do about that.
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I'd like to take a crack at it, the first RPG I ever bought was MERP so I have a special love hate relationship w/ em.
Incedentally the TWG link looks nice on their site which is very nice, neat and orderly.
its down near the Bottom under RPG resources
http://www.ironcrown.com/links.htm#Just
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figgered you would. But I need to find out what's happened with them from fell first. Also, I never got that info from you about that magic school game you were interested in. Human Heads or soemthing was the publisher.
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Yeah... I'll look it up...
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ICE has never sent us anything. SE, jump on it.
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[Saint] Leap! Leap! Leap!
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Leaping Lemurs!
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ZOBOOMAFOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!
What's cool about this is there are two contacts on the ICE news site. One for ICE, and one for Twin Rose, who apparently is a collaborating company in this. So chances for feedback just doubled. heh.
Consider the email sent, Jeffe. (because, well, I just licked "send")
(actually, that's a lie, I didn't. I've decided to call first to see what I get instead, which means I need my phone card, which is at home, so I'll do this tomorrow. email me to remind me)
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well, lo and behold. nearly 3 months after writing to them and receiving no response, what should arrive on my parents' porch? But HARP.
Now, Jeffe gets it, but I've already read nearly half of it. (it's fair, he looked through my birthday present before he gave it to me). It seems pretty straightforward. Nearly every class and race is stolen straight from D&D, and they have talents instead of feats (which admittedly, have a different flavor). It's based on d100 rather than d20, and combat works different. Skill ranks work funky (lots of math, but once you have the bonus written down, you don't have to recalculate during play). Spells are just skills (but only available to certain classes).
and uh... last thing... for some reason, despite all the direct parallels to D&D, it feels more like WHFRPG. Maybe it's the soft cover book and d100 system. <Shrug>
There is 0 setting info in the book other than the basic traits of the races (and let's face it, you can change that quickly), so the GM is expected to get his work done, but there are monster stats and magic items in this 160 page volume. I'm not sure who it's targeted toward. I'd say people like me who don't like settings anyway, but the system isn't original enough. Still, it's a pretty good deal for a complete RPG with a generic fantasy feel
This one's going to be easy to munchkin, since even with random determination, with three acceptable char gen options, 2 of which are point based. Then skills and talents (and even attribute raising) are bought with points (which is kind of a viscious cycle: the attributes determine how many character points you have, but you can raise attributes with them).
I haven't read the combat section (that's next), but a quick perusal of the crit tables (there are 14, based on attack type) shows that Jeffe will be pleased again. No earwax references, but there is "Help! He's fallen and can't get up in the 6 rounds it takes for the fluids within his body to congeal and he dies."
I also liked that they had the guts to say that a round has a fixed amount of time (2 secs). Ok, I guess that's almost a whole review, but I haven't read combat yet, or much about spells or magic items or monsters, so there'll be more to come. I may even let Jeffe write it. :D (you know, since I still have D5, tons of Pendragon, and M&M to do)
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That's really weird, because they sent me HARP as well. Did you give both addresses?
I've flipped through it, and the thing I like the most is that in combat you have to declare your actions before rolling initiative each round. Kind of a neat system, with a lot of added danger. I await Jeffe's review.
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I did not. Perhaps they got all nice because they link to us. <shrug> I dunno, but hey, free kit is free kit.
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cool! do you work today?
I await my review as well!
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I do work today. And tomorrow, and uh... on Christmas I'm busy... in fact, I don't htink you'll be able to pick it up till next week (and I'm done reading it)
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I'm done reading it.
I don't think I like it
two biggest (and only significant) reasons:
You build characters with Development Points, which is fine. The number of DPs you get is determined by your attribute scores, however, which may skew things a bit, but nto much, until 10 levels down the road, because at each level advancement you get the same points as you did originally. If you choose random determined attributes, someone could have tons fewer points in the end. These points buy all skills (including combat), spells, and talents, so they are VERY important. I found this icky. The way around it is to have a fixed number of points, but still, the broken rule exists potentially.
problem 2: too much conversion. You never just roll and compare. In fact, you almost never roll and add a simple modifier and compare. Usually, you take your skill ranks, refer to a chart to figure out what the bonus for that rank is (usually a much higher number than the ranks you have) -- unless it's endurance, in which case you're up for a lot of math, since each race scales differently as to how much a bonus they get for the number of ranks -- then figure in modifiers, which could come from as many different sources as in d20 (in fact, reading their descriptions of modifier sources, particularly in combat, is VERY much like readin the D&D 3.*ed rules for how to run combat), then either roll a second number in the same way, or roll another number with a bonus figured from the first number, or refer to yet ANOTHER chart that details what target number you need to roll against.
Yes, that's the simplified version. This system was supposed to be fast and easy. Sure it'll adjust well to different settings (well, better than d20 does without major tweaking), but the system itself is only slightly less technical than a GURPS wrestling match.
I don't think I like how combat works either, with the offensive v. defensive bonuses. Seems like, on the whole, the DB is rarely significantly higher than the OB, and any positive result on a combat roll (the above mentioned process, only usually without a second roll: instead you add your offensive bonus, then subtract the opponents defensive bonus) results in a hit, which is always called a critical. Erg... better name for a normal hit which does 2 pts of damage, please. This, complaint however, may be the result of not seeing it clear enough. I'd have to play a combat to see how often positive results come up on that roll, but it seems like a LOT.
Anyway, Jeffe, any time you stop by, i've got it for you. But I really am pretty busy tomorrow (Christmas). Friday looks wide open though.