Timewaster's Guide Archive
Local Authors => Brandon Sanderson => Topic started by: Vintage on May 03, 2008, 06:48:10 PM
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We did mention the koloss a number of times in various thread but I thought it would be useful to gather into one topic all that we know or discover about them. For instance, I don't think we did discuss about which metal their nails were. Re-reading, I stumbled unto this :
He set his candle on the table, the fragile light illuminating a few scattered pages, a pile of strange metal nails taken from koloss bodies, and one manuscript.
MB2 p. 552
Now, I need to understand something. I might be wrong. The way I understand it, it's the metal that is strange and not the nails themselves. Would it mean that Sazed did not know the metal ? Are we looking at a different one yet ? But I might be wrong. Could someone clarify this point for me ?
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I think that strange refers to the nails, not the metal. It could be any metal for all we know. Hurray for speculation!
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We did mention the koloss a number of times in various thread but I thought it would be useful to gather into one topic all that we know or discover about them. For instance, I don't think we did discuss about which metal their nails were. Re-reading, I stumbled unto this :
He set his candle on the table, the fragile light illuminating a few scattered pages, a pile of strange metal nails taken from koloss bodies, and one manuscript.
MB2 p. 552
Now, I need to understand something. I might be wrong. The way I understand it, it's the metal that is strange and not the nails themselves. Would it mean that Sazed did not know the metal ? Are we looking at a different one yet ? But I might be wrong. Could someone clarify this point for me ?
Sweet, you found the quote! We vaguely remember that it existed, but we never actually found it. Is this the only koloss-nail quote we see, by the way?
If the nail was shaped strangely, perhaps the shape of metal matters for Hemalurgy. If it is a strange metal, then that could also point to a strange effect of Hemalurgy. Either way, this is Hemalurgy.
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I don't know if shape really does matter all that much, because if you look at the Inqi image on EUOL's DeviantART, it just looks like he has simple railroad spikes through the eyes. It's more than likely that the 'strange' was in reference to the fact that the nails were in them, or their unknown purpose (strange being a synonym for 'mysterious').
I agree that they are hemalurgy of some sort, but I also believe that they are probably like an antenna of sort for the whole emotional-allomancy-R/C-car-effect, or that they just allow it to happen in the first place. Maybe the hemalurgical benefit they are granted is pewter's strength?
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Sweet, you found the quote! We vaguely remember that it existed, but we never actually found it. Is this the only koloss-nail quote we see, by the way?
If the nail was shaped strangely, perhaps the shape of metal matters for Hemalurgy. If it is a strange metal, then that could also point to a strange effect of Hemalurgy. Either way, this is Hemalurgy.
Well, I keep on reading. Never know what you might find...
Mind you, I remember that Sazed had seen the spikes used by Inquisitors, and he had also noticed the different metals used then. I find it strange that he doesn't mention any resemblance. But I keep on searching.
And are nails really similar to spikes ? I mean, it is two different words, it must represent a difference of some sort. But I agree on this : metal is metal and we're talking hemalurgy. Hemalurgy needs blood. Do you recall Koloss bleeding ?
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The Koloss definitely bleed. In fact, the book notes that the blood is a more vivid red than that of humans.
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And are nails really similar to spikes ? I mean, it is two different words, it must represent a difference of some sort.
The English words "nail" and "spike" refer to things generally similar in shape, but nails are usually much smaller than spikes.
EDIT: This post was intended as an explanation for Vintage, from a native-English speaker. I didn't mean to imply any particular significance to the difference.
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EUOL must smile every time he reads these posts. To think that we have gotten to the point where we try to find significance in the difference between a nail and a spike (which is a big nail), or find the many subtle variances which one can use the word "strange". I think the only reason why strange was added to that sentence was to help it pop out at you a little bit. That's certainly why I remember it. My question has always been who puts the nail into the young Koloss? They die a lot, but they seem to make new ones just as often.
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That begs a mental image that I don't want right now.... *shiver* ... Anyway, I bet the parents would, because I assume that TLR can program in a set of instructions, like hypnotic commands that linger after, to do something like that... And I bet Brandon does get a few good laughs every time he comes on here, kind of wish he'd talk to us though.
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He is very busy, though. Can you imagine all the things he must do ? Writing Excuses, A Memory of Light, his annotations of Mistborn 2 plus his signatures assignment, plus his own personal life... And hum... I prefer believing he doen't have much time to read.
Well, when I ask questions about nails and "strange", it's because although I can write, read and speak english pretty well, I am afraid my mind can overlook important details due to my understanding limitations. I just want to make sure I understand properly... and well, I'm kind of lazy and don't want to use a dictionary all the time. Moreover, I think we need the time to think on those things and having a simple analysis could or might enlightened someone sometimes...
Nevertheless... Koloss are so intelligent beast... do you think the size of the nails could influence its brain and not his mass ?
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I am sure EUOL lurks on this forum from time to time, although he does appear to be quite busy. Just having a newborn in the house is enough excuse for me. He has also posted in the past that he does not want to influence our opinions or risk spoiling the last book, so he is staying out of it until MB3. As for your question, Vintage; I have no idea. It is possible that the nails provide some benefit, but it is more likely they are there strictly for control, and may have the side effect of enhancing their emotions, especially anger.
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It is possible that the nails provide some benefit, but it is more likely they are there strictly for control, and may have the side effect of enhancing their emotions, especially anger.
Or perhaps preventing them from having any other emotions than anger and boredom.
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...and a way to switch between the two instantly. I love how they feel the need to explain why they do what they do.
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I love how they feel the need to explain why they do what they do.
Me too. As you might guess from my signature, "He ate my horse." is one of my favorite lines in the book.
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Does anyone know where the nail is taken from within the body, that could be important. And what of the KAndra, they can be soothed into submission as well, however they have no nail that we know of and having one wouldn't make sense give their malleable bodies.
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To my knowledge, there is no mention of where in their body they found the nails. And I confirm, it doesn't say anywhere that Kandra have nails. However, who saw a naked kandra ? Or even just a corpse ? Brandon is hiding something...
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What in hemalurgty, the position of the spike matters. The steel spike is in the back, in inquisitors and Zane, and poke throught the chest, where all the steel and iron lines point to. Vin's earing let's her HEAR pulses thorugh copper clouds, and the pulsing of the well, coincidence? Maybe the position of the koloss's nail has something to do with their powers.
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We actually don't know what Zane's spike is made of, and the Inq's steel spike does not pierce the chest, just the back, and it travels straight down between the shoulder blades. However, I stll like your theory, as the spike would still be in the chest area. That could mean that the two eye spikes would be zinc and brass, since they travel through the brain.
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I seem to recall reading in the book that the eye spikes are both steel. Lemme see if I can find it . . .
Ooh, nope. They're iron. p.70 in Well of Ascension.
And an ominous danger it was. The stranger waited quietly on the worn road, wearing a black robe, standing almost as tall as Sazed himself. The man was bald, and he wore no jewelry--unless, of course, you counted the massive iron spikes that had been driven point first through his eyes.
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Facing one of those though, would you notice the difference between Iron and Steel? That does support my theory about how hemalurgy works, but if I'm right, then the Koloss' nails would be pewter or brass, and it was never quite mentioned what they were made of, I think...
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No it wasn't. The only quote that talks about it is in the opening post of this thread. It really doesn't say much.
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As for Sazed noticing the difference, I would bet that he would be able to tell based on the facts that he spent a fair amount of time with Marsh before they split up after the Lord Ruler's death, and he was in a stable frame of mind when he saw Marsh again. Sazed doesn't seem like the type to mention the iron spikes if he wasn't sure of their composition. He would have just thought "metal" or some such.
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True, true. Then my theory gains another hole in it... Any ideas what passive ability steel would grant, given that Iron grants the ability to see metal? lol.
On a more serious note: I'm surprised someone hasn't jumped in and gotten on us for tangenting so badly...
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Better not to remind them. :-X Anyway, I believe the book seems to contradict itself slightly. If I remember correctly, Sazed's point of view during the end fight with Marsh mentions that the eye spikes appear to be 2 different metals.
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Sorry, Darxounet ;D, but here is the quote :
"Why did you come ?" Marsh whispered as Sazed struggled to his knees. "Everything was going so well." He watched with iron eyes as Sazed slowly crawled away.
So Iron eyes again. It is not a coļncidence. We should call Marsh "Iron Eyes" to not forget anymore.
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I don't know if that was to say that the eyes were made of iron, or if his gaze gave off an especially solemn feel - the same gaze that gave him the name. Further supporting evidence? Maybe we'll have to wait for the annotation...
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I have got to finish Elantris so I can read that scene again. I thought the different metals were noticed after Sazed smashes him in the face with that lantern. To Avalon's point, it could also just be easier to refer to the spikes as iron.
I like how my tag looks when half translated to french, by the way. :) What would it look like fully translated?
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I doubt that. While the argument holds true for the quote during the fight, the way Sazed mentioned the iron spikes in the first quote goes against that logic. He said iron spikes, implying that there were at least two spikes made of iron jutting out of his eye sockets.
While I would accept other spikes in the Marsh's body being made of different metals, both eye spikes are iron.
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Right, makes sense then. Migrating back to the topic (I know, taboo, eh?) is it ever cited what the metal the Koloss' spikes are made of? Also, where are they located? (I just wrote a novel's worth of term papers, so I'm a bit muddled right now...)
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No it wasn't. The only quote that talks about it is in the opening post of this thread. It really doesn't say much.
Well, I can't add more to this, Avalon. lol
As for the use of steel... could it be because it would be the only metal not modifiable by Ruin ? I notice that Kwaan's plate was in steel, and also the map in the Lord Ruler's private basement. It also holds the life of the Inquisitors together so much that they are called the "Steel Ministry". Well, I'll keep on reading for clues as long as we don't find out.