Author Topic: Batman Begins (no spoilers)  (Read 9584 times)

Allison Hill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2005, 01:34:39 PM »
actually, that's exactly what they said.  If they only said that this movie was better than the first four that would be one thing.  But they didn't stop there, they made a silly and unfounded statement that I decided to call attention to.  

Allison Hill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2005, 01:40:50 PM »
of course, I don't know why I'm arguing with you, it's like arguing with my husband.  We obviously don't see eye to eye as far as what makes a good movie.  I have seen many movies that I like that I know are crap, and I have seen many movies that I hate that I know are critically acclaimed "art for art's sake" movies.  On a far different note, I also don't think I like the idea of a "real world" setting for Batman--it's not like spiderman, it's not supposed to be in the real world or it wouldn't be set in gotham city.  

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2005, 01:59:02 PM »
uhm... Spider-man doesn't live in the "real world" either. Not even in the sense you make it. At least, not anymore than Gotham city is part of the real world. Gotham and Metropolis represent different sides to the same american city ideal. Since we can't really expect to see many Supes/Bats crossovers, the idea of a clean, pretty looking city with a visibly seedy underbelly fits that aspect of the contrast nicely. It fleshes out Batman's character and setting in a way that the comics don't because the comics use a different tool for it -- a tool not available to the movies.

Allison Hill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2005, 02:03:09 PM »
yeah, but that seems to get awfully close to Daredevil territory, and that's dangerous

chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #34 on: June 17, 2005, 02:42:53 PM »
e-

I’m sorry that you so entirely missed the point of Big Fish.  It is apparent from your post that you a) do not have kids, b) do not have a father, c) do not have an imagination, and/or d) all of the above.  Big Fish was a beautiful movie.  It was very well thought out, well conceived and well executed.  I found it refreshing, to say the least, that in the world of computers and dot-commers, a movie can still have this much heart.  This is a film that should make every man alive look twice at his relationships with both his father and his kids.  This if a film about imagination, love, storytelling, and above all, the beauty that exists in the world.  Not since American Beauty has there been rumination on beauty that came so close to getting it “right”.  To call such a film “nonsensical” says something about your world-view.

Nightmare is neither scary nor funny.  It was not designed to make YOU gasp.  It was a film that satisfied a need Burton had to make an animated film.  As far as artistic vision goes…bear in mind that it was all done with clay.  Could a computer have generated better images?  Maybe, but this was clay.  The reason for the adoration for the film is based on the perfect cohesion of styles between the artistic designers and Elfman’s music.  It’s the combo that makes this film a classic.

Beetlejuice was a valiant effort from a very young director.  The movie was funny, startling, and odd.  Most of all, the film’s sense of style and overall design vision combined with some pretty beefy special effects (for their day) to create a film that is truly memorable.  Admit it…you will never hear “DAY-O” again without thinking of Beetlejuice.  

Nolan is an upstart.  He has had some early success, just as Burton did.  They simply do not make the same types of films.  I’m glad you liked the new Batman.  But any attempt to put an up and coming director, a critically acclaimed one, yes, but new in the field, up against a director widely considered a master in his field, is foolish indeed.    Tim Burton has the most talented people in the world beating down his door.  He has consistently shown a flair for finding and grooming talent.  He is, perhaps, the only director on Earth whose films I will see on the basis of their director alone.  Why?  Because he has earned it, through consistently giving me more than I could have hoped for.  Has Burton had some failures?  Sure.  One cannot expect perfection…that is to say, not every team is last year’s UTES. A flub or 2 in 13 films is to be expected.

I like Nolan.  I like his work; I like his sense of style.  I hope that one day he has an inkling of the public appeal that Burton has.  As for today…he simply does not.  Let’s talk in 15 years, after Nolan has something under his belt and we’ll see.  As for me…I’ll save my movie dollars for Willy Wonka.
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chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2005, 02:47:16 PM »
woah...strange formatting!  i am not swearing at you...those are supposed to be quotes and apostrophies!
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Spriggan

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2005, 02:50:14 PM »
yes our forum dosen't allow for certain types of puncuation, ie the fancy stuff that Word Prossessors use.
Screw it, I'm buying crayons and paper. I can imagineer my own adventures! Wheeee!

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chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #37 on: June 17, 2005, 02:51:47 PM »
wow...now i know!
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Spriggan

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #38 on: June 17, 2005, 02:53:24 PM »
And Knowing is half the battle!

G.I. JOE!!!
Screw it, I'm buying crayons and paper. I can imagineer my own adventures! Wheeee!

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Fellfrosch

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #39 on: June 17, 2005, 02:58:18 PM »
So are Allison Hill and Chill the same person? Just freakin' register already.

(I also want to assure Allison that she is not being attacked--this is how most of our discussions go, especially our movie discussions. And yes, the Brothers Gibb are prone to hyperbole; you should have seen the fight that developed when they called The Incredibles the best superhero movie and the best Pixar movie ever made.)

Now, back to the discussion at hand: I agree with SE about Big Fish. It was good, like most of Burton's work was good, but it still suffered from the same problems  that plague a lot of his work, including (I hesitate to say this in light of your comments) a hollow emotional core. What worked best about the movie came not from Burton's direction but from Ewan McGregor and Billy Crudup, who were both excellent and lent the movie a lot of substance that wouldn't have been there without them.

edit: aha, you registered and posted while I was typing. Ignore my verbal abuse, in that case.
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chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2005, 03:00:09 PM »
I DID! :P
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chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #41 on: June 17, 2005, 03:01:09 PM »
and though often not seen together at family functions...no we are not the same person.
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Fellfrosch

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #42 on: June 17, 2005, 03:02:55 PM »
So are you Chris, then?
"Tragedy is when I cut my finger. Comedy is when you walk into an open sewer and die." --Mel Brooks

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chill

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #43 on: June 17, 2005, 03:03:48 PM »
si
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Skar

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Re: Batman Begins (no spoilers)
« Reply #44 on: June 17, 2005, 03:07:06 PM »
When I say Burton is a one-trick pony I mean that all his films, every single one that I've seen, are all about the visual.  My only memories from his films are flash images. The plot, the issues the characters deal with, all are subsumed by the visual.  He does it well, possibly better than anyone else but It's all he's got.   His movies universally suffer from a lack of plot and emotional depth.

I've seen Big Fish and frankly the most memorable thing about that movie was Ewan standing in front of the giant and  shaking his hand and all the different characters standing around at the end.

What some people in this discussion seem to be forgetting is that everything they say about Burton films is subjective.  I happen to like more actual substance as opposed to visual appeal in my films than Burton provides.  Other people are the opposite.  Get over it and stop calling people ignorant or implying that they haven't really thought through their opinions just because they disagree with you.  If you have a bone to pick do it with logic rather than emotional flailing.
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