Jedi versus Ninja

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

see, here's the thing.

Ninjas sneak. It's what they do. And Jedi precognition is weak. There's no evidence that it works while they sleep either. I think ninja could get around the precognition.

If a Trade Federation battle droid can kill a Jedi, a ninja sure as heck can.

And, to disagree. Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow are NOT weak ninja. They're like, the pinnacle of ninja-ness.

[42]

I don't know, Jedi sense life-forms. Droids aren't life-froms, but ninjas are. So yes, ninja can sneak, but I think the Jedi would still sense them, unless they are robot ninjas.

And I would have to say that Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow are weak. Have you seen the old GI Joe cartoons recently? Neither Snake Eyes or Storm Shadow have actually killed anything. Heck, I don't think they can actually hit anything. They're wussier than Storm Troopers.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

i'm gonig to have to go back to the ninja magic thing. It's more than blowing things up., It's an aid to sneaking

GI Joe cartoons don't count. Comics count more. Reputation counts for everything.

Anything a gungun can take out is nothing to be proud of having killed you. seriously. If there's anything AotC teaches us, it's that Jedi are hardly immortal. I think it's a longer battle than you think, even if the Jedi do win in the end.

[42]

Reputation counts for everything.

I'm afraid the GI Joe cartoon has ruined the reputation of GI Joe ninjas forever. They sold out to the man.

[EUOL]

I'll have to agree there.

Though, Morag has this theory about SF/F movies.  It goes something along the lines of "He with the least-technologically powerful weapon wins."  (Note--this only applies to heroes and villains, not random grunts.)

That's why the guy with the sword always takes down the guy with the gun--and, if you're in a tank, NEVER try to take out the hand-to-hand martial artist.  Go looking for a battleship or something, 'cuz that's the only thing you're going to be able to beat.  

So, if the ninjas put away their swords and attacked the Jedi hand-to-hand, the laws of coolness would declare that the Jedi would have to lose their lightsabers somehow.  THEN the ninjas would be able to take them down.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

well, by that theory, the ninjas wouldn't even have to put down their weapons. As coool metalurgically a sword made of a steal alloy folded a thousand times is, it's hardly at the same tech level as a light saber.

[42]

But if they put use their ninja swords, then don't they fall prey to Ewoks with rock and sticks.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

yes, they would. But as this is only Ninja and Jedi, they dont' factor in.

Until the sequel.

Then we'll have an argument about whether Gunguns or Ewoks are more primitive.

[EUOL]

By the way, what is Scarlet doing with the ninjas?  I seem to recall her being an archer in the original Joe, and in the new version you have a picture of her with a really big gun.  Hardly ninja-like.

Oh, and I have to disagree on the lightsabers.  They don't count as 'technological weapons,' they just count as 'really cool swords.'  And, a really cool sword beats a regular old sword.  

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

Scarlett has appeared as a figure in many of the "ninja packs" and her data card describes her as a master of several martial arts. Even the old one.
Snake Eyes has always carried several weapons, so ninjas and guns are not inconsistant.

And you're just plain wrong with lightsabers. While they're really cool swords, what makes them cool is their technological basis. Lightsabers definitely out-tech katanas.

[EUOL]

Nah.  Lighsaber 'tech' is like midiclorians.  They're magic swords that Lucas wants to pretend aren't magical.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

not at all. The handle has always been electronics. Even if it is a "magic sword," the magic relies on an underpinning of electronics, which alone out-techs a standard sword.

[EUOL]

You're forgetting the standard 'If it's magical, it doesn't count as more technological than a regular equivalent' rule.  You could argue that other magical swords are just more 'technologically developed' than regular weapons.  It doesn't stand.  A lightsaber trumps a regular sword.

Now, however, if the guy you're fighting with the lightsaber only has a DAGGER--well, watch out.  He'll take you down with that.  If he has a bazooka or an at-at, it's not a problem--you can take those down without a problem.  But if he has a dagger (or, in Episode Two terms, a little wire thing that shoots from his hand) you're in deep trouble.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

but that argument doesn't work. I was about to argue that a magic sword IS more technologically developed than a standard one. Non-magic wins over magic according to the low-tech rule. It's the underdevelopment, not the scientific nature. Besides, my point is that the lightsaber may be magic, but it's magic CIRCUITS, made to simulate a sword. Circuits are higher tech than swords. The fact that the lightsaber should "trump" a normal sword is in fact an argument for the ninjas, since it's the underdevelopment that wins.

Beides, the jedi have more gear too. Luke has a blaster (a clear tech development over anything the ninjas have, even with their big automatic weapons), Anakin has a portable long range, voice activated communicator. Darth Maul has his repulsorlift bike and those spy drones. Even Yoda has a repulsorlift ride.

Looks like the Jedi are going down. Even if only those individuals go down, takes out half the jedi already. Then the Ninjas have numerical superiority.

[42]

Course, a katana is actually quite the piece of technology. There is a lot of science that goes into crafting one of those things.

And technically, the katana didn't come around until 700 a.d. Well after the invention of the light saber which appeared long ago in a galaxy far, far away. SO it could be argued that the ninjas have the more technologically adavanced weaponry.