Timewaster's Guide Archive
General => Everything Else => Topic started by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on September 12, 2003, 09:43:28 PM
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So I'm going through this dating site thingy my friend told me about, since I guess I suck at this whole "find the girl, date the girl" thing. So there I am going through the girls in NY on campushookup.com, and what do I find? None other than the girl I'm working with in PR for the school.
It's really freaky. Now I have no idea how to approach her about this, or if at all I should talk to her about it. Just let it go... augh, this is confusing. Now I'm confusled.!
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You want my advice? (whether you do or not, here it comes. YOu can be reasonably certain that my advice is at least worth hearing, as I've gotten married, but that may have been a freak chance).
Anyway, my advice is just to ask her out. DOn't mention the site or anything. Just ask her out. To something you know she'll like (you must have a list of "likes" from that site). Make it something really fun but something you can interact at.
That is all.
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Dont mention it to her! But do ask her on a date with no strings attached...
I find that girls freak about commitment on date with guys who tell them how much they like em on the first date...
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Dude, she has a boyfriend though. Ya know? Do you know where the kink is in that plan my friend? Hmmm? Explain that one to me.
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the best reason to go on a friend date....
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thats like... a really bad idea. Maybe worse than giving morphine to small children.
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Yeah, are you sure that level 20 for student of nature is "Lesser Druid" and not "King of Bad Ideas?"
ok, then you stay away from her. Ask someone ELSE on a date. Otherwise follow above advice
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Is she married? Then she's fair game and not some sort of chattel property.
If you like her you can hang... If your a prick you'll abuse that closeness to try something stupid.
Since you seem like a nice guy be honorable as well. Don't make any moves physically and romantically on her while she's seeing someone. Be like the troubadors....
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have we even established that he even REALLY LIKES her?
Now, everyone can be treated as a friend, but whatever the technicalities, it is tres uncouth to move in on a "taken" woman. Not because she belongs to someone, it's just bad form if she's happy and not being abused.
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Personally i would be inclined to ask her boyfriend about the dating website thing. Just for malicious mayhem :P
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Now THERE'S an interesting idea.
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Good point, actually. If she's using a dating website, then how serious can she be about this other guy? She's obviously interested in other dating opportunities.
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ok, there's a good point. But ignoring the fact that the web site may be previous to her relationship, or that her friend who doesn't like her SO may have set it up FOR her, do you want to be the guy who dates a girl who goes behind her man's back and sets something up like that? Also, do you want to be the guy who breaks up couples? I'm just thinking "Do unto others" you know.
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Ask her how serious it is....
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I still vote for "get over her."
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I do believe the [term deleted] has a point. She's on my horribly named "To Do List." And by that I mean, after my failed attempts to date other girls, she'll be... how do I say it... next in line. You get what I am meaning, da?
[This post subtly altered by Fellfrosch...can you guess where?]
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So she'll be the last one you fail to get on with? (and I guess I'll need a new title to avoid that horrible confluence of the r and the m)
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You should, but theres no need to be quick about it. And no, I'm not getting it on with anybody(though a problem lies in that). I mean I want to date them, you know, go through the motions, or the motionless motions. You know.
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Yeah, I know. YOu want to be chaste, and few here would find that foogy. Most would respect and encourage it. But nothin' wrong with having a woman to chill wid (despite their frequent lack of care for time wasting, they're generally more fun to hang with than guys).
Just keep trying, focus on having fun instead of heady, commitment laden, intense relationships. You'll meet some chicks.
</wise old one>
Oh, and I'm only a post away from level change, so we'll see.
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Dude...you went from semenmaster to demented deranged dude, who says he didn't do anything.
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To whom are you referring.
Growing up, Saint Was remarkably chaste due to his religious ideals. It cause some stress in his life sure, but he has a wonderful wife and knows what it means to suffer... :) But seriously he waited for the right girl and it was super special.
I cant imagine him with another woman.
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I'm referring to SE's new promotional title. In no way does this reflect his current lifestyle.
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1) I never said I didn't do anything :o
2) I went from messin' around to serious. I should use mood tags. <sarcasm></sarcasm> being the most important.
3)Plus I'm now an "errant" preacher, which means I like to tell you what to do a lot. Either that or I make a lot of errors. To be honest, either is possible.
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And likely.... ;)
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Jeffe, get off the msg board and save some oil spill. ;D
Actually, get off and respond to some of hte billion emails I've sent you. Esp about Project Deep Blue.
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I did respon all yesterday to the billion emails... or didn't you notice... Im writing something on the side right now anyway so I prolly wont get to it until tomorrow.
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uh... no... didn't see any of 'em. Sure you sent them?
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yeah... yesterday from my comcast acct... including one to take my work acct off of the list...
since it seems comcast gave me problems dont do that yet...
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how many did you send? I don't see anything from you on either of my accounts. Are you still using "reply" instead of "reply to all?"
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nope, I replied to all... I sent about 6 emails yesterday.,..
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THen you'll need to resend them. Cuz They ain't here.
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dangit.... I hate comecast.....
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Man. I missed the whole dating conversation? Too bad. I'm sure you all wanted a little EUOL philosophy on the point. I am, after all, the master of dating...
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The master of avoiding dating...
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EUOL: Master of Dating.
That's definately an oximoron. Like helpful Customer Service.
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Lay it on me EUOL. I wanna hear your insightful opulence.
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That's definately an oximoron. Like helpful Customer Service.
I'll have you know that I have been in many cust serv positions, and I have always been proud of my ability to actually help. I worked tech support for MS for 3 months before I would even allow a call to be escalated (passing it on to someone else). And yes, I solved all those problems.
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Women are like thunderstorms. Sure they're kind of cool once in a while because they look pretty and make some interesting noises, but most of the time they're terribly inconvenient.
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rofl
see you when I visit terrestrial land, EUOL
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Best. Quote. Ever. Almost.
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Nah. A better EUOL quote is, "Girls? Oh, those are the things with long hair that smell nice."
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And that one misses the point entirely.
It's the soft curves, my friends. THAT'S what's nice about women. The soft curves.
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Listen to him. He's actually been out on a date.
AND he's married. So he must know what he's talking about.
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Who EUOL? Guess I'll have to listen to him. He is only one that makes sense.
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I doubt EUOL has been on a date in the past 6 mo, or even a year. He's the only person I ever knew who actually tried to keep track of how few dates he had been on in year. I think his record was 1.
Saint has been married for 5+ years though.
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I think my "0" beats his record of 1.
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Curves. Gentlemen. SOFT curves.
..mmmm.... soft curves.....
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Yes, but you're probably not pushing 30 either. Not that EUOL is that old. But he's getting there.
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actually, he IS pushing 30. I turn 30 in less than 3 months, and EUOL isn't that far behind me.
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I will, of course, use this opportunity to start calling you "gramps", "old man" and other mildly insulting phrases :D
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So MoD, what are you trying to say? That I shouldn't take advice from SE or EUOL? That I should take it from you, or Jeffe, or Entrophy? I am being the confused one, da?
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Don't take it from me, thats for damn sure.
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And there is no "h" in my name damnit.
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Well, I'm pushing twenty, so he beats me by a decade. I guess that makes his record more impressive.
Gemm, do take advice from me, but do the exact opposite of what I say. That should work.
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I'm saying you should take advice from Saint.
You definately should not take dating advice from EUOL.
I could give you advice from the female side of the universe, but you haven't really asked a new question, and the last one has already been advised on. ;)
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But if he does the opposite of what you say then he will be taking advice from you and then opposing you at the same time and his head will explode...!
I wouldnt take my advice either really, though I have been lucky in love.
At your age innocent and cute works just as well as Sexy and dangeous when it comes to getting women. Be intense, show an interest in them and then act like you don't know what your doing and you should have the girls lining up to fall all over you....
The friend thing can work, but expect angst. Angst and girls are a bad combo, kinda like bourbon, everclear and rancid milk... sure you could get drunk, but do you want to?
Be open, honest and true to yourself, don't lie about your intentions and play up your strengtha dn weaknesses. If you like the girl enough ask her out even if she is dating. When I met my wife (in highschool by the way) she was dating another guy just because I hadn't asked her out yet... when I finally got the guts after pining away for her for months she asked me why I hadn't asked her sooner.... :)
Course if this girl says no, you just move on. College will take care of all your girl woes soon enough.
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Ha! 27 is pushing 30? Wow. Well, guess I'm more mature than I thought.
As for my dating history--just because I didn't feel the need to let anyone at TLE know about my dating life doesn't mean there wasn't or isn't one. I treated TLE like I treat my parents--they're better off thinking I'm ignorant and never dating, that way they won't bug me about it.
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Jeffe is also married, so he's roughly trustworthy as well.
Of course, there's always the argument that we only got lucky, but we did at least try, which means being lucky was possible. It doesn't happen for people who fear females. ;)
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Ok MoD, here's a question for you. How do women like being approached? I'm having a really difficult time approaching this one girl.... and yes, I can't speel approaching.
This isn't an MoD only question. Anyone else who wants to, go ahead and chime in, I implore you.
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Ok Jam, but before one can take your advice you'll have to give some. I hope this clarifies a few things for you. Such as conception can't take place until after sex. Or a cow has to eat to give milk.
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Ok, I was referring to any advice I may give in the future. But since you want some:
My general inclination is to approach the person, and start sweating and increasing heartrate. Then, look left and right quickly, like you're paranoid. Follow this with a really bad, rushed and unclear/ambiguous comment. Then run away quickly.
Do the opposite of that and you should be right.
BTW, cows start as calves, so they have to drink milk before they can start to eat and give milk. Unless they're bulls, in which case it's probably best to avoid trying to milk them, even after they've eaten.
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I never felt old untill the day I joined the Coast Guard (I was 23) and I discovered that I was older than 3/4 of my boot camp company by 4 years or so.
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uh... that bit about the cows... you guys worry me.
and Jam, you spell "approaching" better than you spell "spell"
Girls like to be approached in a way where you aren't making it obvious that you're "approaching." They want to be, and for you to be, comfortable having a conversation. Unless they like you already, in which case they find your ineptness cute. It's imposssible to pull of the ineptly cute thing on purpose. Because if you know she likes you (and therefore know it will work) then you have too much confidence and it comes off fake; whereas if you don't know she likes you, it's not an act.
They also claim to be interested in sensitivity and sense of humor, but there seems to be little objective evidence backing this up unless the relationship has already begun. Mostly be interested in them, but answer questions about yourself (this is rule #5, which is completely contradicted by rule #6: be mysterious). I think mostly they want someone who looks like he knows how to have fun, especially when that fun is not at the expense of other people. A natural centeredness in being happy is a huge leap in creating a female relationship.
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EUOL, you talked about dating. And you took pride (read: boasted) in the fact that you didn't.
Gemm, how well do you know this girl? (Yes there are different approaches for different situations) Is she dating someone else?
I think the best strategy is to become good friends first. Then you can get a feel for what she would want to do, how she interacts with other people(important to know if you actually want to talk to her on the date ;)). And you can be a whole lot more casual about asking her out. Which is easier on both of you.
If you don't want to wait that long, then try and pick something that you know she will enjoy, something with other people, like a play, or a concert or a monster truck rally (I hear some girls like that) and ask her casually if she'd like to go.
(The casually is very important because a lot of girls are scared that if they agree to go out with a boy that he will then start to stalk her. I know the percentages of that actually happening are low, but I've seen it happen. And I'm sure you can understand how some girls would prefer to skip the free dinner in preference to not having a stalker.)
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and ironically they don't like guys who try too hard.
Or to be blunt appear to try to hard. Plan dates in such a way that they appear spontanious and have options in the back of your mind... (ok plan A is bollocksed lets go with plan B)
The secret to approaching a girl...
Actually doing it. Its all about controlling anxiety, and letting yourself get comfortable with rejection. Hey its going to happen sometimes so relax take a deep breath and fall. But there are some tricks to help. Ask in an environment that you feel comfortable in... the phone can be one if you feel more relaxed as a disembodied voice, in line at Mcdonalds might be another. Maybe carry a lucky rock or something that you can project some sort of confidence on. Thats the trick with the innocence thing by the way, be confident and innocent (thats an advanced course btw)
In all honesty you don't actually lose anything by asking any girl out. Not even pride, sure rejection hurts, I dated a girl in Greensboro who refused to go out with me six times... when we finally started dating I realized what kind of a person she really was and I ended up dumping her in the long run. Remember that dating isn't like your getting married or engaged, your trying the person out to see if more might be worth it.
Dont feel pressured to get romantic right away either... I had a very satisfying relationship with a girl I never kissed once. She was fantastic, by the way loving and loyal and wonderful (Becca I hope your doing great out there)
Ask yourself what you can do to be comfortable asking her out, and not get generic advise. There is no magic formula to get a girl to say yes, no matter what mars or venus books may say. The only important thing is that you get over your fear of rejection. Its not personal, and there is no shame in trying and failing. When you look back on your life you shouldn't have a lot of what if's. What if I had asked her, what if I had taken this job or done this. Be comfortable being yourself, if you feel strongly about something professionally or romanticly or personally do something about it. And spare yourself the what if's.
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MoD: Lol. Of course I boasted. I've learned that if people assume you're completely hopeless in a particular area, they get frustrated and leave you alone. You should have realized that if I was that insistent that absolutely nothing ever happened, then you should be more suspicious than ever.
However, I will admit that in this area, at least, I’m not much of an expert. I average about one date a month, mostly with women who show no discernable interest in me. Ah, well. From my experience, that is generally how dating goes.
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I figured you were dating. Just not very often, and obviously not effectively, since you were available so much. That doesn't mean I don't think you're completely hopeless. ;D
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If you want to talk about rejection, let's get Mustard in here. He had a hopeless crush on three different women in high school, and was rejected by all three of them at least once a week for months. Every time it happened he'd come to me and say, "You want to hear a funny story?"
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Eric and I wanted to write a sitcom in college that had the running gag of him getting rejected by girls he asks to marry him every episode, It centered around his superstition that a refused ring was somehow tainted so he just keeps em in a fishbowl which eventually fills up.
I think you'll find the anxiety you've built up about asking her out is worse than any rejection you could feel Asking her is kind of a release.
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True, Fell. In highschool there was one girl, Jenny, who I was completely wupped over. I would ask her out all the time (I think I asked her to every single dance, and a multitude of dates. ) I remember only actually going out with her once - although I can't remember where we went. The problem was that I was hardly ever rejected initially. Normally she would say yes, and then call later to cancel saying that "something came up, but I'd really love to do something some other time." My problem was that I actually believed that - even though this happened twice a week for four years.
I think that my main problem was that, in high school, I wouldn't ever date a girl unless I though she was marraige material. Consequently, I had an extremely narrow category of girls I wanted to ask out - and all three of them were either uninterested or hooked up with someone else. I did end up going on plenty of dates, but whenever some date opportunity came up, I would always ask the three of them, get rejected, and then move on to someone else.
On a different note, the year after high school, my friend and I (looking for a good use for the database program on our computer) made a Date-a-base (we thought the name was really clever). We entered all the girls we'd ever dated or wanted to date. Then, we could just ask the computer to, for example, give us a list of all brunettes who have green eyes and enjoy bowling, and it would pop out a list of names. It was never very helpful.
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Ok, well today was my day of reckoning. I summoned forth that voice in my head. We argued to one another before english and I convinced him that I would do it! I was primed and ready to just do it. And damnit if I didn't. Because I didn't. I could've went after her, I should've, but I didn't. I didn't. I just didn't do it. Another weekend to myself, in room, all alone.
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Listening to bad rap music.
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Weekend to yourself, in room, all alone...? Surely you've got friends to hang out with despite the lack of date? That's another thing when it comes to dating--if you don't succeed, get out there and have a life anyway. Good things happen along the way.
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Thats what i tend to do, read books and play the computer most of the time, but i am something of a loner at heart in real life. It's only online that i turn into a outgoing scottish freak.
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Heh, that's are good idea stacer, except I'm here at a college where I'm 6 hours away from home. So I don't really know anyone here. And I also suck at meeting new people. So I am a home-run derby kind of guy.
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I met my husband when I went to a Dance competition to watch my friend compete. Then I got to know him better through a friend I met at TLE. You're not going to meet anyone sitting in your room all weekend.
At least go be bored in the library where there are other people. ;-) You never know . . .
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Yeah, that is hard, being away at college. But haven't you made friends with people on your floor, or in class, or maybe there's a campus club of something-or-other you'll want to get involved in? I had it much easier socially my first year of college, as I lived in a house that was kind of like a sorority. We had to attend a certain number of house events per semester, and just the fact that they had all sorts of activities, starting with an orientation and scavenger hunt all over campus the first weekend we moved in, got us involved.
Another thing about being Mormon, for those of us on the board that are, is that we automatically have a social group at church no matter where we move. So when I moved here to Boston--and before, when I moved to Chicago--all I had to do was go to church and start introducing myself to people, and eventually I found interesting people to be friends with. It's much harder when you don't have an instant social group like a church or a sorority.
So, Gemm, I feel for ya. But I do think you can, over time, find people with similar interests on campus. Most of the BYU people on this board know each other from TLE and related things like game night and writing group, which was how I met 42 and Brenna and EUOL and MoD, etc. Well, actually Brenna and I had a class together and she announced TLE, and I decided to go with her one night, if you want to get technical. My point is that I bet if you went to your school's website and looked up clubs, or if there's some other way of finding out activities on campus like a bulletin board, you'd find gaming people or book groups or whatever. I don't know what school you're at, but that's my general experience, having attended 4 different colleges/universities across the country, and it tends to be the same.
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I bet you could find a sci-fi club or a gaming club without breaking a sweat. Of course, then you'd have to hang out with sci-fi geeks and gamers. And you'd never meet any girls.
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I don't think Church is such an automatic social club. I can't count the number of friends I've made at church that I actually do things with (or did) on one hand.
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Do you mean you CAN count them on one hand? Or that the number is slow low you could only count them on a hand with no fingers at all?
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Hey now. I've met a few really good friends at Church. Just many more from classes and clubs, and very few from my ward.
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For me it's pretty much the opposite. Well, unless you don't count roommates. Most of my longest-term friends have been through a ward. Especially when single and living outside of Utah (i.e., now). Saint, when you were single, did you ever live in a non-Utah singles' ward? In Chicago and Boston, for me, that's where I've met most of my friends.
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I wouldn't count roommates, because they'd be your roommates even if you didn't go to church.
And I'm not counting Institute of Religion either, because you have to choose to go to that even if you're active in your ward. And I have met a lot of people that I hung with at IR. I consider that more of a "class" than "church."
While I did attend a singles ward for a bit, I wasn't really a member of the ward or a regular attendee. I was mostly there to scope for chicks.
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I think you could include Institute in the "Church helps you make friends" category. Her point was that active Church membership helps you make friends quickly in new places because of the way it's structured socially. Institute applies to that rather directly. Roommates don't, though, you're right about that.
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eh, ok, point conceded. But I think it also meant that a social system was intact just by being active. And you can be active without going to Institute. So I still think of it as related but distinct, because it's outside the "normal" church-going activities (like FHE groups, ward prayer, break-the-fast feasts, firesides, etc), and it's independent of the Ward.
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Institute was much better for making friends than young singles too.
Gemm, buddy, you need to get out of your room!
Go to a campus club of some kind, play an intermural sport or go see an inexpensive show or something. Heck go out to Slevin (7-11) buy a bunch O' party stuff and have a gotta spend the weekend doing something party with your door wide open and a sign outside saying come and meet this planets answer to world hunger!
My first few weeks at College were tough also, but the only way to get over them is to hang out with the people who are there.... A great place to meet people is the public dorm lounges (cussing at the TV is fun)
or go bug your RA for a little bit.
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Ok, ok, ok, ok, ok. Now this thought has rung through my head on and off for a while now. So I've implored myself to ask the fine folks at TWG-Forums.me. Why, oh why is it that women do not approach the men? Hmmm? This bugs the bugs butt out of me. I've always wondered about this, you know?
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The main lesson that I learned in all my vast dating experience: Women DO approach men. They just don't approach YOU.
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I'm just gonna reaffirm hom on this one. There are aggressive chicks. And that should be a sign to all of us who haven't been approached.
Oh, and plus: not all women who will approach men are well, desirable to have approaching you. Jeffe knows who I speak of in Greensboro.
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Yes there are women who approach men, plenty of them, and some of them are desireable and some of them arnt.
The bulk of women don't ask men because in our society they don't have to. Complaining about it wont help you go out and say hi.
But the undelying issue isn't really about asking for a date, it actually seems to be making friends and doing stuff doesn't it Gemm. Those friends should be women and men and you should go out and meet a lot of people.
Seriously, oh and make friends with someone who has a car so you can go on road trips.
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And also, for the same reason men don't approach women. The woman doesn't seem approachable and the man's too chicken.
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so you're saying all women are chicken?
(hey, it was either that or playing on the "women don't approach men because women are unapproachable" wording).