Author Topic: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*  (Read 15050 times)

Tangletalon

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2010, 04:55:37 AM »
My guess is that Kaladin's raw power has maxed out now that Kaladin has taken the oath of the knights radiant.  It seems like a good mortal (i.e. Elantrian or Returned or powerful Mistborn) level, and will take a lot of practice to master.  Also, it seems to me that it is the same level as Szeth has hit, and Szeth never said anything about increasing in power over time, nor have we seen such shown onscreen.
He only spoke the second Ideal of the Knights Radiant, I think there are more, so perhaps he has more power to come as he gets mroe in sync with Syl through committing himself to the rest of the Ideals, or perhaps not.

Actually, I did think of something.

The knights radiant are always shown using Shardplate and Shardblade.  Glowing Shardplate and Shardblade.  Yet, somehow, the current magic users are adverse to using them.  Maybe overcoming that particular weakness will be a way for Kaladin to power up again, as it were.  Heaven only knows he's going to need the help.
The ones that we saw.

It's possible that the Surgebinding orders didn't use plate.
The Surgebinders didn't use plate,  although they probably used blade. They didn't because, as it says on page 29 in the hardcover (end of the page): "His Lashings interfered with the gemstones that powered Shardplate, and he had to choose one or the other."

rjl

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2010, 03:26:54 PM »
Tangletalon: it's possible that Szeth is wrong, it has been postulate that some special method is needed to use surgebinding whilst wearing plate.

Munin

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2010, 05:54:30 PM »
Or that the Windrunner orders used some kind of special Shardplate designed to work with Surgebinding.
There's a difference between what's best and what's right. What's best might be different tomorrow or the day after, but right and wrong will stay the same after a thousand years.

Salkara

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2010, 08:16:52 PM »
Perhaps Stonewardens(?) used plate while Windrunners used the blades.

Munin

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2010, 08:35:25 PM »
Perhaps Stonewardens(?) used plate while Windrunners used the blades.
We already went over this. Re-read the previous page.
There's a difference between what's best and what's right. What's best might be different tomorrow or the day after, but right and wrong will stay the same after a thousand years.

Cheese Ninja

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2010, 02:00:30 AM »
I wonder if further Ideals after the 2nd allow the use of shardblade and shardplate.  There's 5, for each order, and the 1st is the same for all of them.  Kaladin leveled up after saying the 2nd.

Did anyone else notice this:
Quote
Holding his breath, he clung to the Stormlight. He could still feel it leaking out. Stormlight could be held for only a short time, a few minutes at most. It leaked away, the human body too porous a container. He had heard that the Voidbringers could hold it in perfectly. But, then, did they even exist? His punishment declared that they didn’t. His honor demanded that they did.
- Szeth, prologue
Quote
Kaladin relaxed. He was still steaming light, and—save for the call to Lopen—he’d been holding his breath for a good quarter hour. That could be handy, he thought, though his lungs were starting to burn, so he started to breathe normally. The Light didn’t leave him altogether, though it escaped faster.
- Kaladin, when he's climbing up with the rocks

Szeth said it could only be held for a few minutes, then Kaladin holds it (and his breath) for 15 minutes?

Galavantes

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2010, 02:04:55 AM »
I wonder if further Ideals after the 2nd allow the use of shardblade and shardplate.  There's 5, for each order, and the 1st is the same for all of them.  Kaladin leveled up after saying the 2nd.

Did anyone else notice this:
Quote
Holding his breath, he clung to the Stormlight. He could still feel it leaking out. Stormlight could be held for only a short time, a few minutes at most. It leaked away, the human body too porous a container. He had heard that the Voidbringers could hold it in perfectly. But, then, did they even exist? His punishment declared that they didn’t. His honor demanded that they did.
- Szeth, prologue
Quote
Kaladin relaxed. He was still steaming light, and—save for the call to Lopen—he’d been holding his breath for a good quarter hour. That could be handy, he thought, though his lungs were starting to burn, so he started to breathe normally. The Light didn’t leave him altogether, though it escaped faster.
- Kaladin, when he's climbing up with the rocks

Szeth said it could only be held for a few minutes, then Kaladin holds it (and his breath) for 15 minutes?

15 minutes could be considered a "few" minutes for the purpose of narration.

Stormblessed

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2010, 08:31:20 AM »
I see spren as physical representations of emotions. As an honourspren, she is created from honour. The greater the honour, the more powerful she comes, and the more conscious of her surroundings she becomes.

I think that Szeth isn't bonded to a spren, maybe gaining his power through some sort of Fabriel instead (his power instead coming from an imprisoned spren that may lie in his oathstone - which may explain the bond between the stone and himself). That is why he can't wear a shardplate, because the gems in the shardplate conflict with the fabriel. However, with a purely made bond between spren and human has no such limit which is why windrunners were able to wear shardplates.
"You've killed me. Bastards, you've killed me!
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guy

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2010, 07:12:38 PM »
Dalinars vision with Nohadon implies that surgebinders dont need to bond with just honorspren, others work too.  maybe only people bonded with honorspren can use shardplate

jcats

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2010, 09:18:16 PM »
another possibility, what if the reason Syl doesn't like Shardplate/Shardblades is the fact they to get the full power out of them, you have to infuse the Gems with Stormlight, and a Spren.   Syl "knows" this instinctively, and feels that all the blades and armor around her are empty, hollow shells, just waiting to Suck her in and Trap her.


see Translation Thread for explanation.

Never

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2010, 09:26:59 PM »
Shardplate runs on gems. Is there any indication that shardblade does the same?


Xavien

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #26 on: September 22, 2010, 11:05:04 PM »
I think that Syl's aversion to Shardblades is related to the revulsion that Dalinar feels when he is fighting (and also possibly why the Radiants threw down their Shards and stopped fighting).  They have come to represent objects of power and mindless killing as opposed to ones used to protect and defend.

guy

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2010, 08:34:30 PM »
whose ideas of honor do honorspren follow, because honor is different from one culture to the next, is there one universal way that honorspren adhere to, or is it completely up to the individual

happyman

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #28 on: September 24, 2010, 02:19:37 PM »
whose ideas of honor do honorspren follow, because honor is different from one culture to the next, is there one universal way that honorspren adhere to, or is it completely up to the individual

I would say that in Roshar, there apparently is an objective standard of honor.  If you don't like it, well, that's fantasy for you.  It doesn't always fit the real world.

And even in the real world, some people would claim that an absolute standard does exist, although this is not the thread to debate that on.  Just tossing it out there.
Nature hates being reified.

Stormblessed

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Re: WoK: Kaladin and Syl *Spoilers*
« Reply #29 on: September 24, 2010, 03:54:20 PM »
Honour is a strange one. We would become philosophers if we were to have a proper conversation about it.

I see honour as being true to what you believe in. Never trying to hide it, or go against it. Honour is not necessarily good, but neither is it bad. It is subjective.
"You've killed me. Bastards, you've killed me!
 -- Darkeyed Soldier