Author Topic: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)  (Read 7012 times)

CabbyHat

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #60 on: January 20, 2011, 01:32:54 AM »
That could play out really interestingly. Because it would require Dalinar to forgive him, and after what happened that would require friggin' divine levels of honour and mercy. Of course, if there's any character to display such a thing...
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Miyabi

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #61 on: January 20, 2011, 08:17:43 AM »

You could shank Dalinar and say sorry and he'd forgive you.
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andygal

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #62 on: January 20, 2011, 08:26:11 AM »

You could shank Dalinar and say sorry and he'd forgive you.


 :D
I seriously don't think Dalinar's gong to forgive Sadeas for his latest  stunt anytime soon.
And Kaladin isn't going to forgive Sadeas for using the bridgemen as cannon fodder anytime soon either.

Tortellini

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #63 on: January 20, 2011, 05:17:12 PM »
That could play out really interestingly. Because it would require Dalinar to forgive him, and after what happened that would require friggin' divine levels of honour and mercy. Of course, if there's any character to display such a thing...

Ha, he'd be so crowded in Stupidityspren that he couldn't see anything and walk off the ledge of a chasm... ;D

CabbyHat

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #64 on: January 21, 2011, 04:38:44 AM »
That could play out really interestingly. Because it would require Dalinar to forgive him, and after what happened that would require friggin' divine levels of honour and mercy. Of course, if there's any character to display such a thing...

Ha, he'd be so crowded in Stupidityspren that he couldn't see anything and walk off the ledge of a chasm... ;D

Well you can forgive someone without necessarily having to trust them again. There are people in my past that really hurt me; I don't nurse a grudge against them, but I wouldn't trust them not to do the same thing again without some kind of proof. A large part of the point of Dalinar's viewpoints is that you can be honorable without being stupid.
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dhalagirl

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #65 on: January 21, 2011, 04:59:16 AM »

Well you can forgive someone without necessarily having to trust them again. There are people in my past that really hurt me; I don't nurse a grudge against them, but I wouldn't trust them not to do the same thing again without some kind of proof. A large part of the point of Dalinar's viewpoints is that you can be honorable without being stupid.

That's very true.  Besides, Sadeas' crimes don't deserve death....just lots and lots of pain.  Hearing him scream and plead for mercy would be entertaining and satisfying, death would not. ;D

chandran

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #66 on: January 21, 2011, 07:23:20 PM »

Well you can forgive someone without necessarily having to trust them again. There are people in my past that really hurt me; I don't nurse a grudge against them, but I wouldn't trust them not to do the same thing again without some kind of proof. A large part of the point of Dalinar's viewpoints is that you can be honorable without being stupid.

That's very true.  Besides, Sadeas' crimes don't deserve death....just lots and lots of pain.  Hearing him scream and plead for mercy would be entertaining and satisfying, death would not. ;D

So... you want him to become of the new heralds and scream in agony for a few millennium between each desolation?
but yeah, I agree. Sadeas will most likely end up redeeming himself in some way.

Ari54

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #67 on: January 22, 2011, 12:54:15 AM »
In fact, I can't help but like Taravingian. Here's a guy who believes in the Almighty, as evidenced by his debate with Jasnah early in the book, knows he's completely dooming himself by his actions to whatever doom these guys believe in, and yet continues his actions because he believes his saving the world. And for all we know, he might be right with what he's doing. He calls these people his dear friends, and is still willing to sacrifice them. Evil? Completely. But he might be just what the world needs at this point.

Yeah, I would much prefer a Taravingian book to a Shallan, Adolin, or another Kaladin book, but I don't think it's happening. Some characters need to remain mysterious.

Actually, I find that this makes Taravingian even more disturbing, because he has been warned against this behaviour by an authority figure he clearly trusts but in his own self-aggrandizing arrogance thinks that ethics are for other people, not him, and he's got to do whatever it takes to win. He may have given up what he perceives as his ultimate reward, but by doing so he's undermined the whole foundation of what he believes in and no longer has a coherent philosophy to stand on. In short, he's not just a person going to monstrous lengths to do something that's probably good, he's also a hypocrite.

dhalagirl

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #68 on: January 22, 2011, 03:49:04 AM »

Well you can forgive someone without necessarily having to trust them again. There are people in my past that really hurt me; I don't nurse a grudge against them, but I wouldn't trust them not to do the same thing again without some kind of proof. A large part of the point of Dalinar's viewpoints is that you can be honorable without being stupid.

That's very true.  Besides, Sadeas' crimes don't deserve death....just lots and lots of pain.  Hearing him scream and plead for mercy would be entertaining and satisfying, death would not. ;D

So... you want him to become of the new heralds and scream in agony for a few millennium between each desolation?
but yeah, I agree. Sadeas will most likely end up redeeming himself in some way.

I don't necessarily want him to become one -- although the millennia of torture would be great -- but I do think that he will eventually become one just because he'd crap monkeys if Dalinar did something that he couldn't.

andygal

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #69 on: January 22, 2011, 03:59:55 AM »
I don't think anybody deserves millennia of torture for anything. I just want him to be humiliated, preferably by being forced to beg Kaladin and Bridge 4 for his life. In front of all his underlings. Being made to publically beg for mercy from a bunch of the darkeyes that he exploited would be the ultimate karmic punishment for him. Wouldn't need to be any pain involved. The abject humiliation would be enough.

dhalagirl

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #70 on: January 22, 2011, 04:09:27 AM »
Good point andygal.  I'd be happy with abject humiliation.  But I'm still not giving up my dream of pushing Sadeas into the great pit of Carkoon. 

socom-delta

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #71 on: January 22, 2011, 09:18:01 PM »
OK, I just finished listening to the Way of Kings audio book and it took my breath away.  Was that the best ending ever or what?   :o  Brandon is getting better and better with every book he writes, and Mistborn was already one of the best books I’ve read.

One thing that really got to me was just how much I hated the villains in the book.  I really wanted to just reach into the book and strangle those rat bastards, didn’t you?  I’m not truly sure why I disliked those villains more than villains from other books… maybe I hated them more because they seemed more realalistic than the typical mustache twirler?

Anyways, here’s my list in order of villains that need to die.  Forgive my spelling of some of the names because I have only listened to the audio book so far and haven’t read my hardcover copy yet.

(the King of Kharbranth, right?)
Sadious = Sadeas


#1 King Taravangian  – a true bastard
#2 Szeth – I can’t wait for Kaladin to take him out.  He knows what he is doing is horribly wrong, but he does it anyway in the name of his hooky religion or culture or whatever. 
#3 Sadeas - I can't believe he betrayed Dalinor even after having his life saved
#4 Amaran
#5 Brightlord Roshone

Roshone is just straight-up scum and needs to be strung up by his gonads.

Szeth isn't a villain; he's a tool and hates how he's being used. He's kinda ignorant and naive, though; these are things that let him be used. It's odd that he won't break his oath no matter what.

I don't think Taravangian is really as evil as he seems. I think Taravangian is exercising some brutal, nefarious means to his ends but he believes he is just. IS he a force for good, simply misled? Is he purely evil? This hasn't been expressed.

Amaram isn't bad. True, he did a bad thing by killing Kaladin's friends and exiling him into slavery, but based on the judgment he gave he actually did the right thing by taking the shard. You don't just throw away a Shardblade and Plate. They're just too powerful and they mean too much to give away. I don't blame Amaram for t aking them but I wish he could have found another way.

Sadeas... yeah, Sadeas needs to die. Definitely. He's scum of the highest order, just another spoiled, money-grubbing nobleman with a penchant for violence and brutally oppressing his lessers.

andygal

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #72 on: January 22, 2011, 09:52:05 PM »
Roshone is petty, small-minded and bitter. I feel bad for Laral, being stuck married to him...especially since he's 3 times her age.

KhyEllie

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #73 on: January 22, 2011, 11:57:45 PM »
Taravangian seems to believe his cause is good. I think he really does believe that whatever he finds from all these little snipets is going to save the world. But that doesn't for a moment excuse the way he's going about doing it.

socom-delta

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Re: WoK: Top 5 Villians That Really Really Need to Die (*Spoilers*)
« Reply #74 on: January 24, 2011, 04:41:13 AM »
sacrificing a few to save many? and the 'few' are mostly people who are dying or terminally ill or so ill they wouldn't survive on their own. pretty messed up, but what he's doing could end up saving the world.

Considering that, I see him like Szeth: good at heart but sorely misguided. Used.