Author Topic: ***SPOILERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon****  (Read 125515 times)

Phaz

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This is a MB3 spoiler thread, not an Alcatraz one, so I won't get into details, but after just finishing the 2nd book, I think a shard reference could be there.  The graph that explained the Talents is surprisingly similar to the Alomancy one.

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I haven't read Dragonsteel in years, but those three words are pretty unforgettable.
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“There are three Realms of ex. . .existence. The Spiritual, and the cog. . .natib. . .”

“Cognitive,” Master corrected. “The Second Realm is the Cognitive.”

“The Spiritual, the Cognitive, and the Physical,” Jerick repeated, reading from the first page of his book. “Of these, the Spiritual is. . .dominant, followed by the Cognitive, and finally the Physical. The Spiritual Realm is the Realm of the di. . .divine, where the [REDACTED] reside, and it is this Realm that controls all.” Finishing the paragraph, Jerick looked up eagerly. “You see, Master, I have been practicing.”

Sorry, I couldn't resist. (The rest can be interlibrary loaned from the BYU library.)

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There were bits of all of this popping around in my head almost twenty years ago, so it's going to be hard to define where what fit into place when.
Twenty years ago? At the same time Jerick was an elf?
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firstRainbowRose

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I have a rather simple question.  What was Spook's real name?  He gives a easternese slang term that becomes his name, then he goes by his Kel given nick.  So, what was his birth name?  (Yes, I wonder about random things like that.)
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Qarlin

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #108 on: October 18, 2008, 04:37:26 AM »
So are all these epic novels in the same universe? Elantris, Mistborn, Dragonsteel, all that?

sporkify

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How did Inquisitors find Atium mistings?
Before, Inquisitors had supernatural healing.  How did they get the Feruchemists for the spike?  Were the keepers not so hidden after all?

And this is more towards the whole physics stuff, but is Feruchemy really balanced?  If it gives diminishing returns, wouldn't this end up as a net loss of power?
How much control do allomancers have over pushing and pulling metals? 
Gorram Frakking Woolhead!

Xandeis

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Ok, I am new write and reading forums, so I'm a little slow on it, so please be kind.....
1.) What if RAFO?
2.) Who is HOID? I have read Elantris and all 3 Mistborns but don't remember the name, am I missing something?
3.) Dragonsteel, is that by Brandon or L. Yep, I am soooo confused.
4.) These Shards everyone is talking about...what are they?

I would be glad for someone to eliminate my ignorance on these matters....

As far as Kel's grabbing the power to Pres to hold for Vin, was it him that whispered to Spook, when Spook was unconscious, to get his message to Vin?

firstRainbowRose

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Ok, I am new write and reading forums, so I'm a little slow on it, so please be kind.....
1.) What if RAFO?

That means "Read and Find out".  Don't feel bad, I had to look that one up too.
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #112 on: October 18, 2008, 05:41:24 PM »
2. Hoid:
Page 445 of the Elantris hardback
Page 269 of the Mistborn hardback
Page 231 of the Warbreaker 4.2 PDF
Chapter 1 of The Liar of Partinel (book 1 of the Dragonsteel/Aether series)
This is not an exhaustive list, but he pops up (unobtrusively and generally forgettably) from time to time. We don't know what his overarching purpose is (besides being a way for Brandon to tease us).

3. Dragonsteel:
The book Brandon wrote right after Elantris. (He also started coming up with a very early version of the story when he was a teenager but didn't get very far.) Dragonsteel was the first book of Brandon's that I (and a few other TWGers who knew Brandon at the time) read, making us Brandon converts. He used the book as his Honors English Thesis, and the one bound copy is available at the BYU Library. Last year Brandon decided to go back to the Dragonsteel world to start a longer series of which the original Dragonsteel book, heavily rewritten, would make up book 3 (or something like that). The Liar of Partinel, which Brandon has finished writing and of which he released one chapter on the website, is the first volume of the new Dragonsteel series (which also uses elements from another of his cannibalized novels, Aether of Night). When Brandon decides that an early book he has written just can't be revised into a workable form, he cannibalizes it, taking the good parts and characters and adding other elements to get a better ultimate result—elements from four different books (Mistborn Prime, Final Empire Prime, Mythwalker, and Aether of Night) were cannibalized into Mistborn and more of Mythwalker was cannibalized into Warbreaker.
The first draft of The Liar of Partinel needs a lot of revision, but Brandon is busy and won't get back to it for a while. Because of the high-profile nature of A Memory of Light, he wants his next book released after that to be the start of a major epic; The Liar of Partinel was meant as a sort of backdoor pilot into the Dragonsteel series rather than the true start of a major epic. So Brandon is going to concentrate instead on Way of Kings as his next big series.
Dragonsteel itself is also a super-valuable metal (that starts off as a liquid that distills in a certain place rather like atium does in the Pits of Hathsin) in the novel Dragonsteel. (Note: Anything known about the old drafts of Dragonsteel is subject to change; it's not canon until the book actually comes out. Warbreaker's current form is final-candidate canon.)

4. Shards:
That's the big mystery that we have found out about only in the last couple days. Brandon has apparently used the same cosmological underpinnings for all of his adult fantasy novels that are out so far (and possibly Alcatraz too, but that seems problematic to me since it's set in our world, more or less). However, most of the characters in these novels are not aware of these cosmological underpinnings at all; if they are aware, it is of how the cosmology affects their own planet only. Aspects of Adonalsium (the Creator?) have been broken into shards, two of which are Ruin and Preservation, the only two shards "on Scadrial at the moment" (which may indicate Hoid is not a shard himself, though he is obviously related to the hidden overarching plot somehow). Brandon says we have met four other shards in his published books (including Warbreaker). The dissolving pool in Elantris is a manifestation of one of these shards like the Well of Ascension was a manifestation of Preservation.
"Shards" are also important throughout Way of Kings. However, it's been years since I read it last and I don't know if these are the same type of shards or are at all related. Way of Kings has its own complex theology and, while it's possible it ties into the overarching cosmology of the other books, I wouldn't pigeonhole Brandon into only writing books in one universe. He has too many creative ideas to pigeonhole himself. We will have to RAFO.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2008, 06:38:58 PM by Ookla The Mok »
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Xandeis

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FirstRainbowRose & Ookla,
Thanks for the insight and answers!!!!

Xandeis

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Just to have a little fun,
If we could make Mistborn 1-3 into movies, who would get to play:
Kelsier
Vin
Lord Rule
Sazed
Dockson
Breeze
Ham
Club
Spook
OreSeur
TenSoon
Elend....

Nessa

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Just to have a little fun,
If we could make Mistborn 1-3 into movies, who would get to play:
Kelsier
Vin
Lord Rule
Sazed
Dockson
Breeze
Ham
Club
Spook
OreSeur
TenSoon
Elend....

This has actually been talked about in an old thread I'm sure Brandon wouldn't mind you ressurecting:

http://www.timewastersguide.com/forum/index.php?topic=4476.0

(If you talk about that there then you won't be hyjacking this thread into something other than what he intended...)
« Last Edit: October 18, 2008, 09:41:17 PM by Nessa »
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Chaos

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Readers have met four shards other than Ruin and Preservation.
Have we met these four by name, or just by influence? I can't think of a name that would go with the one that the Elantris lake is a manifestation of.

Hoid could be one? I know nothing his purpose other than that he shows up in lots of different books, sometimes begging and sometimes telling stories. Since most of these series happen on different planets (though two of them may happen on the same planet as each other), I'm assuming he has mad planet-hopping skills.

...Nightblood...

Thank you for giving those extra Hoid references, Ookla. I didn't remember those Elantris or MB1 references, though I distinctly remember him in Warbreaker because he was on there for a bit more than a page :P Hoid definitely made it in the 6.1 Warbreaker PDF (in case you haven't read anything past 4.2. 6.1 was my first Warbreaker read-through).

I thought Nightblood was explained sufficiently for my tastes in Warbreaker, so I doubt that it is a Shard, but I've been plenty wrong before. Also, I don't know if Hoid could even be a Shard. Certainly he has mean planet-hopping skills, but I don't know what purpose a celestial storyteller would have in this universe. He doesn't really have the same kind of power as Ruin or Preservation did, so normally I would rule him out right off the bat. But it is possible that these Shards come in many shapes, not just in the near-deific quantity Ruin or Preservation had. I think it's a bit of a stretch to say Hoid is a Shard... but, then again, I don't have any ideas for what those four other Shards are.

Maybe Hoid is just a traveler trying to find remnants of Adonalsium and stories about them. He doesn't need to be a shard, I suppose.
www.17thshard.com - The Official Brandon Sanderson Fansite.

Oh SNAP, I'm an Allomancer.

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Wow, I only noticed Hoid in Final Empire and Hero of Ages, but I can see him being in Elantris as well.  My thoughts is it's just a sort of joke, like in Pheobe Gilman's childrens books she always includes items or characters from other books in her illustrations.

This Shards thing is so cool, I'd totally love to see Raoden and Kelsier fight, even though that's impossible.  In Elantris I'd say there are two shards, the lake and the dor.  The Dor is the power life, and the lake is the power of rest.  Similar but not the same as ruin and Preservation.  The way the Dor can be harnessed in a variety of ways makes me even more certain that it is a shard. 
I think Kelsier would beat Raoden though.  Raoden could do pretty much anything, like automatically kill Kelsier with an aon, but they are too slow, Kell would have him down before he finished drawing.

I think most of my Questions have been answered, thanks Brandon!
1) One Question is this.  If Gold is used to make Malatium, couldn't malatium also be gold's compliment?
2)I also wondered if you could explain that circle in the cave some more, I didn't quite get it.
I was sure Vin was the hero right up until the end, even though originally before I read the book, I was sure it would be Elend or Sazed.  But then the epilogue author started naming people off, so I knew it wasn't them.  But it only mentions Vin as 'she,' when talking about how she got her spike.  I was sure one of the epigraphs was going to be: "And that girl is me."
The Sazed thing totally made sense in hindsight, I can't believe I didn't figure it out.  And we were right about the "on the arms," bit being the part Brandon was referring to, good find Vintage!
I'm a little sad that the lake doesn't come into it more.  But the Mist spirit and the Deepness were BOTH Preservation.  That was cool.
3) So here's my last question.  If there ARE people on the other side of the world, did Vin kill them all by placing the sun on their side, or do they have they're own Ruin/Preservation battle going on over there as well?  Do they also have allomancy feruchemy and hemalurgy?

So those three numbered points are my questions, great great book, it was simply amazing!
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"There's always another secret..."
- Kelsier

Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #118 on: October 19, 2008, 12:23:23 AM »
To me the dor seems too primal to be a shard. Though "ruin" and "preservation" are pretty primal concepts as well, so I could be wrong. I suppose not every shard must currently have a personality.

On another note, wouldn't "breaking" just be the same as "ruin"?

The personalities don't seem integral to the shards, since Ruin's and Preservation's personalities died and Sazed took up both shards. If that's the case, Nightblood could be a shard without knowing it; the shard could have gotten attached to him during his making by accident somehow. The sequel is to be called Nightblood, so I think there's a lot more to his story than was revealed in Warbreaker.

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If Gold is used to make Malatium, couldn't malatium also be gold's compliment?
Sure. See your own alternate reality/see someone else's alternate reality is a fine pair. But if atium doesn't really belong in the grid, then why would an alloy of atium belong in the grid?

Also, if electrum isn't gold's complement, that would mean it is silver's complement, since electrum is silver and gold. But silver doesn't do anything. Supposedly.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 12:29:46 AM by Ookla The Mok »
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firstRainbowRose

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I have a question (I knew there was one when I was done.  I just couldn't remember it.)  Is Sazed effected by the metal blindess, or can he see thing written in metal?
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"