Author Topic: ***SPOILERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon****  (Read 162651 times)

Peter Ahlstrom

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For every known metal other than zinc, brass, atium, and malatium, the base metal is the pulling metal and the alloy is the pushing metal.  Zinc is a base metal and is the external mental pushing metal, however, and its alloy brass is the pulling metal of the pair.  Is this a mistake?
Zinc and brass keep getting confused. Zinc is the pulling metal and riots emotions. Brass is the pushing metal and soothes emotions. Anywhere you see them act some other way is a mistake.
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douglas

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The source of my information about zinc and brass is the table in the back of Final Empire.  That table does list zinc as rioting and brass as soothing, but it has zinc as the pushing metal and brass as pulling.

Vetta

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #287 on: October 23, 2008, 03:34:17 AM »
Right but afterward she didn't have anything to keep her drawing on the power because Marsh was gone.  You got to realize that she didn't know exactly what she was doing, and I think she only got to the power because she was desperate.

I think that I found something that might shed some light on the issue.      The the pre-chapter 79 little blurb page 524:

"I believe the mists were searching for someone to become a new host for them.     The power needed a consciousness to direct them.

snip

Marsh ripped it out, freeing her and allowing the mists---which were now desperate for a host, since Preservation's last wisp was gone--- to finally pour themselves into her."

The Key phrase there is "allowing the mists.......to finally pour themselves into her".     So at Fardex City when she fought the Koloss these same conditions existed.     It was not contingent on Vin drawing the mists in (which she did to fight Marsh) but them - the mists - that poured themselves into her as soon as they were free to do so.


Another question.

The vials that Vin stole from Marsh contained Duralumin?      How/why would that be?      I know that Ruin would have learned of it from TenSoon/Zane but he would have to get a spike from an Duralumin Misting or a Mistborn.     A Misting would be impossible to find wouldn't it?       Did Ruin waste a Mistborn on Marsh to give him this ability?        It does not make sense to me that Ruin would do that.     Much more value to make another Inquisitor from the Mistborn and have him able to burn Duralumin.       After all Marsh already had so much extra Feruchemist spikes that the Duralumin would only be a tiny benefit.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 03:39:58 AM by Vetta »
I Mist You

Sylos

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #288 on: October 23, 2008, 03:49:09 AM »
Right but afterward she didn't have anything to keep her drawing on the power because Marsh was gone.  You got to realize that she didn't know exactly what she was doing, and I think she only got to the power because she was desperate.

I think that I found something that might shed some light on the issue.      The the pre-chapter 79 little blurb page 524:

"I believe the mists were searching for someone to become a new host for them.     The power needed a consciousness to direct them.

snip

Marsh ripped it out, freeing her and allowing the mists---which were now desperate for a host, since Preservation's last wisp was gone--- to finally pour themselves into her."

The Key phrase there is "allowing the mists.......to finally pour themselves into her".     So at Fardex City when she fought the Koloss these same conditions existed.     It was not contingent on Vin drawing the mists in (which she did to fight Marsh) but them - the mists - that poured themselves into her as soon as they were free to do so.


Another question.

The vials that Vin stole from Marsh contained Duralumin?      How/why would that be?      I know that Ruin would have learned of it from TenSoon/Zane but he would have to get a spike from an Duralumin Misting or a Mistborn.     A Misting would be impossible to find wouldn't it?       Did Ruin waste a Mistborn on Marsh to give him this ability?        It does not make sense to me that Ruin would do that.     Much more value to make another Inquisitor from the Mistborn and have him able to burn Duralumin.       After all Marsh already had so much extra Feruchemist spikes that the Duralumin would only be a tiny benefit.

On your last question about Marsh having Duralumin, Yes ruin did waste a mistborn to give Marsh the ability. If you review Sazed's epigram on page 484,  you will see that Marsh was a special case
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 04:03:05 AM by Sylos »
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Sylos

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Question about the Symbols for the Metals.

Each metal has a symbol consiting of one or more crescent moon shapes along with one or more spikes piercing the crescent moon shapes. Do the placement of the spikes in the symbols have anything to do with the Hemalurgical placement of a spike in a human body. Sort of like a hemalurgical guide to acupuncture. :) Place one spike here for alomantic powers and one spike here for foot fungus.
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fbd

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I have one question, and it NEEDS to be answered.  When did they discover the game of cricket?

Page 192 "Plus. you've managed --in our short three years together-- to kill not only my god, but my father, my brother, and my fiancee.  That's kind of like a homicidal hat trick"  (Bolding is mine)

The term hat trick was invented for cricket, and adapted to other sports (notably hockey), first used in the 1880s.  That one line took me out-of-world for a good five minutes.

Also, Elend can't count, because hat trick is 3, and she killed 4.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 08:45:12 AM by fbd »

Epsilon

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I just finished the series and hopped on to read through this thread when I should be sleeping. :)  Now I'm registering and posting when I should be sleeping...

Overall, I think your books are fantastic, Brandon.  I have been amazed at how consistent and thought-out your worlds are.  You do an amazing job of dropping hints without being too obvious (When I figure out your secrets on my own, it's usually only pages or paragraphs before having them explicitly revealed -- which feels like just the right distance since I get to feel accomplished but the story isn't).  I also really like how your characters make rather-specific plans, begin carrying out those plans, and react realistically when they go (believably) awry.

Minor criticisms:  I couldn't take Sazed's final lines about the Hero being of neither gender seriously.  He may be insecure about his masculinity, but he's referred to as he, falls in love with a woman, and (presumably) has the same genetic makeup as other males.  He is male.  Losing genitalia doesn't change gender and I just didn't buy that the prophecy authors would be gender-neutral to refer to a eunuch.  Anyway, personal problem...

I also felt like you hedged your bets a bin on Vin and Elend dying.  I realize it's your work with your cosmology, but nothing takes the impact out of death like finding out they aren't really really dead and could possibly come back in the future.  Death is meaningful because it's permanent.  I don't think it's cliched to either kill your heroes or to not kill them.  Both have their pros and cons; half-killing them seems like it will leave many people dissatisfied.

......wooooooooooooooah......

I still can't stop thinking that in my head. It's all that's really coming to mind at the moment.

I made the stupid mistake of finishing the book this afternoon in a public place. Therefore I looked like a complete moron as I burst into tears when Elend died. I think it was a good ending. I'm still not totally decided on that. I'm just in shock.

It's just so amazing how the books progressed, developing into this huge cosmic epic that I never expected from just reading The Final Empire a year ago. I guess in some sense what I'm feeling is a slight sense of... awe, maybe? I want to know how he comes up with stuff. I mean seriously, talk about not just writing another fantasy series.

But I'm also shocked that no one else seemed to have figured out that Sazed was the Hero of Ages. I thought it might be him when I started the book, but it could as easily have been Vin or Elend. But at about a third of the way through, page 215 to be exact, there was this line from Sazed thinking in his head:

"I am, unforunately, in charge."

Sound familiar?

"I am, unfortunately, the Hero of Ages."

No one else would have used the same wording as Sazed did when he was thinking to himself. I have to assume that was intentional on Brandon's part. It was very subtle... I'm actually surprised I noticed.

I'm gratified that you noticed.  The Terris dialect IS very subtle.  That speech pattern is one hint, the other is the use of "I think" to soften phrases at the ending.  Beyond that, Sazed speaks with compound, complex sentences using frequent hedging to indicate that he's often uncertain.  (That's another Terris speech pattern, not wanting to offend with language.)

The epigraphs in this book particularly (though I did it for Kwaan too) are intended to "sound" Terris, and like Sazed in particular.  I didn't think anyone would catch it.  You made my day!

My wife and I definitely noticed.  That was the first thing I noticed about the book (obviously, since it's the first line. :)).  I really enjoyed the pre-chapter blurbs in 1 and 2, so it was on my mind as I opened to book.  My entire thought process was:

"This person doesn't sound like Vin.  She wouldn't say fortunately or unfortunately.  She's more fatalisted.  To her, what is... is and you deal with it; there is no fortunately or unfortunately.  Maybe it's Elend...?  I know these blurbs are part of a huge curveball like they were in 1 and 2."

By the time the narrator used the word "Elend" instead of  "I", I was pretty sure it had to be Sazed.  And, as Pygmalion, pointed out, bells went off in my head when I read "I am, unforunately, in charge."  I started to doubt myself when Vin became a god but I just couldn't hear her voice in those paragraphs.  Vin is simply too blunt for that scholar's prose.  I'm glad I stuck to my guns. :)

Anyway, I have several questions I was hoping you could answer:

1) I haven't yet seen this asked / answered:  If Rashek was simply an Allomancer / Feruchemist, how did he survive beheading?  In The Final Empire, doesn't Ham or Breeze mention he was beheaded in the early years and that it didn't even phase him?  Nobody else seems to survive that, regardless of their powers.  I was hoping to see something about that in the later books...

2) This is related directly to The Final Empire, but was there a reason you chose not have the characters understand the horseshoe trick until the very end?  I never quite believed that Mistborn had never figured out that they could simply Pull their coins back to them after jumping off them.  It was one of the first things that occurred to me and I'll never have that kind of power... As a reader, I actually felt a bit insulted when Vin had that "revelation."

Thanks for the great stories and being so involved in this site.  It's a real treat to get your answers / insight outside of the books!

darxbane

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1) I haven't yet seen this asked / answered:  If Rashek was simply an Allomancer / Feruchemist, how did he survive beheading?  In The Final Empire, doesn't Ham or Breeze mention he was beheaded in the early years and that it didn't even phase him?  Nobody else seems to survive that, regardless of their powers.  I was hoping to see something about that in the later books...

This has been asked before, and I believe the answer was that those stories were fabricated to make him appear invincible.  TLR was pretty insane by the time Vin came along, so it is not surprising that he began to believe his own rhetoric.
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firstRainbowRose

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I have one question, and it NEEDS to be answered.  When did they discover the game of cricket?

Page 192 "Plus. you've managed --in our short three years together-- to kill not only my god, but my father, my brother, and my fiancee.  That's kind of like a homicidal hat trick"  (Bolding is mine)

The term hat trick was invented for cricket, and adapted to other sports (notably hockey), first used in the 1880s.  That one line took me out-of-world for a good five minutes.

Also, Elend can't count, because hat trick is 3, and she killed 4.

I'm not sure where you are, but where I live Hat trick is just kind of become a cliche to mean something along the lines of amazing feat.  I didn't even know it had to do with either sport until you said something.
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Baggins

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As for Vin's horseshoe trick, I think it's less a matter of "no one else thought of it" as opposed to "no one else could DO it."  Vin, remember, had amazing and incredible precision with her steel-pushes and pulls.  (Part of this would likely have come from the fact that she grew up as a thief.  Remember, other Mistborn came from noble families and had no need to develop the subtler skills in their youth.  And a large part of it would also be because Vin is, well... Vin!)  As for the horseshoe trick, Elend was able to do it, but mainly because he was taught specifically by Vin, who had mastered it, and even then, he still had trouble, I believe.

JCHancey

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This has been bugging me so I have to ask: Did you base the bodies of Ruin and Preservation off of someone you know or was it simply someone who had taken the power before?
RJF: "I spit upon the ground where you no longer ever existed."

Dount Cooku

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1) I haven't yet seen this asked / answered:  If Rashek was simply an Allomancer / Feruchemist, how did he survive beheading?  In The Final Empire, doesn't Ham or Breeze mention he was beheaded in the early years and that it didn't even phase him?  Nobody else seems to survive that, regardless of their powers.  I was hoping to see something about that in the later books...

This has been asked before, and I believe the answer was that those stories were fabricated to make him appear invincible.  TLR was pretty insane by the time Vin came along, so it is not surprising that he began to believe his own rhetoric.

I asked Brandon this question at the "Teraport Wars" signing at the Dragon's Keep a few weeks ago.  He said that Rashek was only partially beheaded, and had kicked in his Feruchemist healing powers previously.  Thus, he was able to heal himself.  This happened in the early years of the Lord Ruler's reign, so the story had been changed by the time of the first book.

The same thing happened with the story of the Lord Ruler emerging from the flames as a skeleton.  Rashek wasn't actually down to just his skeleton (although he may have looked like it).  He had his healing powers going as he walked through the flames.  Again, the story had grown and changed to "legendary" by the time of the first book.

Brandon added that if anyone had managed to fully behead Rashek, that would have been the end of him.

Peter Ahlstrom

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I have one question, and it NEEDS to be answered.  When did they discover the game of cricket?

Page 192 "Plus. you've managed --in our short three years together-- to kill not only my god, but my father, my brother, and my fiancee.  That's kind of like a homicidal hat trick"  (Bolding is mine)

The term hat trick was invented for cricket, and adapted to other sports (notably hockey), first used in the 1880s. That one line took me out-of-world for a good five minutes.

Also, Elend can't count, because hat trick is 3, and she killed 4.
The characters don't speak English, so what we read is a translation into our language. Elend in his native language actually used an in-world equivalent metaphor, possibly one which involved a set of four rather than three.

I do think it's a good idea to pay attention to anachronism when using metaphors and idoms, but that's also something that can be taken too far—for example, trying not to use any words with latinate roots because there was never a former empire of that type in the universe you're writing in. That would probably be impossible because English is what English is, and the book is written in English.
All Saiyuki fans should check out Dazzle! Emotionally wrenching action-adventure and quirky humor! (At least read chapter 6 and tell me if you're not hooked.) Volume 10 out now!

hamateur

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #298 on: October 24, 2008, 01:58:48 AM »
I'd just assumed that it was a hat trick of 3, with half-brother Zane and sort-of-fiancee Shan only counting for 0.5 each.
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Shrain

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Re: ***SPOLIERS Official Hero of Ages Spoilers Thread. Includes Q&A w/Brandon*
« Reply #299 on: October 24, 2008, 03:14:05 AM »
Brandon,

   It's good to have you back, haunting the boards. Here's what I've been wanting to post for so long but couldn't until the book came out!

Reading the final installment of Mistborn was an undeniable pleasure--a literary indulgence of the highest order. The storyline has hairpin turns and secrets aplenty. The characters overall display mesmerizing depth, development, and conflict. The world itself continues to evoke a powerful set of emotions, creating an eerie, magical aura that we can’t ever forget--nor would we wish to. The magic systems--now more than ever--outshine so many other magic systems because Allomancy, Hemalurgy, and Feruchemy relate to each other in a typically fascinating and logical way, possessing an astounding level of complexity and uniqueness.

Spook’s elevation to a major player is something I hadn’t quite expected but welcomed all the same. I enjoyed watching Spook come into his own as a leader and a man who deserves to be part of the crew. I didn’t find it hard to feel swept into his inner and outer conflict, rooting for him as an underdog worthy of achieving greatness. Another smart twist was Ruin’s masquerade as Kelsier for Spook--not to mention Reen for Vin. If the only thing we have to fear is fear itself, then Ruin embodies fear itself.

Marsh lives the nightmare. He is not his own, though he is, ironically, the means by which Vin is ultimately saved. Though tainted, Marsh recaptures enough of his will to remove the taint from her. His storyline evokes so many competing reactions, adding layers to him and the narrative that are masterfully chilling and uplifting at the same time. A uniquely memorable character.
TenSoon, for he’s a jolly good kandra, for he’s a jolly good…. Well, you see where I’m going with that. I loved learning more about him and his people. His courage is so amazing. It is easy to warm to this being, even though he did away with OreSeur. The revelations about the First Contract and the First Generation were masterful, if not completely unexpected.  The truth about atium is an ingenious and intriguing one--to have the power of a god burning within oneself is quite the concept. The foreshadowing of this truth is quite satisfactory, too. Elend serves Ruin a deserved comeuppance that is deliciously funny although I saw it coming. Huzzah!

“Breezy” is as pompously hilarious as always, and Ham is as Thuggish and loyal as ever.  It’s kind of bittersweet that only Breeze, Ham, Spook, and well, Sazed, survive. But where much is given, much is required, huh?

A good assassin, indeed. Rest well, Vin, for you have undoubtedly earned it. Elend fought the good fight, and it was fitting that the end of his fight prompted Vin to forcibly re-merge the powers of Ruin and Preservation, clearing the way for the self-doubting, humble Sazed to become the Hero of Ages. 

Speaking of which, Sazed’s transformation from a once-disillusioned, “barren” Keeper into the very power he’s always appealed to--the potent, life-preserving God or Hero of Ages--is beautifully touching. Also of note is the poetically clever, entirely believable (and just plain cool) means by which Sazed heals a dying world and then rewards, as best he can, those who would not go gently into that good night. (Yeah, the book even got me crying a few times.)

Packed with humor, horror, action, tension, friendship, love, and revelations, this novel does overall justice to the ones preceding it and weaves a magical story to be proud of. Which isn't to say that I don't need MORE. I've been excited to read your responses to various questions. Marsh isn't dead?? Awesome. A follow-up triology might be in the works? Even better.

Thanks for creating such a great series.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2008, 03:22:42 AM by Shrain »
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