Author Topic: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes  (Read 6372 times)

Peter Ahlstrom

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ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« on: August 31, 2008, 12:23:28 AM »
Check it out: http://www.bic-media.com/dmrs/widget.do?skin=blue&isbn=9783453524156

Translates as "Alcatraz and the Parchment of Death." That's a pretty good title too (for book 2).

Oh, cool, page 4 says "Translated from Americanese."
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firstRainbowRose

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2008, 12:27:23 AM »
But... but... but... how come they get number two now?!  How come people across the pond get the book before us here in america get it when HE'S FROM THE US?!
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2008, 12:47:59 AM »
It doesn't come out until November there, if you check the copyright date, so it's the same as the US. They're just previewing it a little ahead of time.

I don't even see book 2 listed on Scholastic's website though. Odd.
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firstRainbowRose

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2008, 01:27:37 AM »
Ah... dang it, I wish I could read... german?  Russian?  Whatever that is.
"The custom of royalty in referring to oneself is to naturally employ the royal 'we'.  We are very happy, we are very sad, we are bored and suffer from ennui.  For a royal prince there's no such word as 'me', It's always 'we'.  So rightfully I should be two or three, don't you agree?"

Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2008, 03:53:04 AM »
Yes, German.
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Reaves

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2008, 01:09:24 PM »
lol i would've guessed portuguese. Not because i know a word of Portuguese but because i thought it looked similar to Spanish  :P
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Miyabi

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2008, 05:19:01 PM »
A literal translation would be "and THAT"  But that doesn't make sense in English. xP
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2008, 06:26:38 PM »
Harry Potter book 7 is Harry Potter und die Heiligtümer des Todes. Coincidence?
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Miyabi

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2008, 07:13:36 PM »
In HP the 'die' is the article for 'the'  and in Al the 'das' is that.

I prefer Japanese.  No articles to worry about. xP
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happyman

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2008, 08:45:38 PM »
Harry Potter book 7 is Harry Potter und die Heiligtümer des Todes. Coincidence?

The similarities come because they both talk about death, which is, in German, "Der Tod".  The "der" is simply "the", but in German, it indicates that the noun is masculine.

When you make it possessive, "of Death" becomes "des Todes", where "des" is the genitive (in practice, think possessive) form of "the" for nouns with masculine gender.  It could also be translated as "of the death" except that we don't typically say "The death", unlike German.

The "und" is simply "and".  So because both titles have "[Name] and the [item] of death" (in German, at least), there are going to be similarities between their titles.  But most of the similarities are simply grammatical necessities in German.  The content is in the blanks that are, in fact, different.

And yes, the "das" in the sentence is part of the noun phrase "das Pergament", which simply means "the parchment" ("pergament" is apparently neuter).  "Das" can mean "that", but not in this context.

Incidentally, all my German is old missionary German, so while I've got the grammar, the vocabulary mismatch makes trying to read it a real pain.
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2008, 09:56:12 PM »
I wasn't actually asking for a serious comparison, but it may be that the phrasing of Alcatraz 2's title in German was done with the Harry Potter book at least vaguely in mind. Alcatraz 2's English title is Alcatraz Versus the Scrivener's Bones.
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Reaves

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2008, 10:06:22 PM »
whoa, that is strange. Do books often change titles when they are translated?
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2008, 11:08:54 PM »
Yes. It's pretty common. They can even change names going from one English-speaking market to another, or from paperback to hardback within the same market.

But when a title gets translated, it's almost certain to be altered in some way. It all depends on the market.
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Miyabi

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2008, 11:18:01 PM »
Yes, like HP 'alchemist's stone' became 'sorcerer's stone' in the US.  I don't know why though.  To me Alchemist's stone makes MUCH MORE sense.
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: ALCATRAZ und das Pergament des Todes
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2008, 12:51:05 AM »
That's Philosopher's Stone. But anyway...
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