Author Topic: Vin as HOA?  (Read 35999 times)

Iahawki99

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Vin as HOA?
« on: April 21, 2008, 04:00:39 AM »
As I am re-reading The Well of Ascension a thought keeps popping into my head. What if Vin is not the HOA. What if Elend is? The writing that Sazed is translating sounds as much like Elend as it does like Vin. Am I way off here? Anyone else think this is even remotely possible? If it is then this would be a pretty cool twist, but I thought I would ask some of our more smarter(lol) readers their opinions.

Again this is just a thought that keeps popping into my head. I could be way, way, way off here. There could be so much "evidence" that Vin is the HOA as to make this post quite rediculous(sp?) but i can't recall reading anything that jumped out at me about it. Anyone have any prophecies or anything else that you can recall to prove my point wrong?

Not sure if I want to be proven wrong but I am curious to know what everyone thinks.

Chaos

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2008, 04:26:10 AM »
In a Well of Ascension annotation, I remember Brandon saying that it was difficult to write the part where Vin thinks she is the HoA. He said he wanted it to seem plausible from her perspective, but at the same time, not absolutely confirming it for certain.

So, Vin isn't necessarily the Hero.
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firstRainbowRose

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2008, 06:14:17 AM »
I have to say I don't think so.  Both "Hero"s we've read have been able to since the well.  If i remember correctly (I haven't re-read them recently) Vin actually meantions to him the pulses she feels, and he says he doesn't notice them.
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Iahawki99

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2008, 08:15:08 AM »
I will preface this by saying that I have not read any of the annotations yet so I apologize if there is information in it that I am not aware of to answer these questions I pose.

But isn't she noticing the pulses are really far away and not at all where it actually ends up being?  Doesn't that imply she is being led around on some wild goose chase.  I am trying to remember if that is correct as I type this. 

Plus just b/c you feel the pulses doesn't mean you are the HOA does it?  The reason I say that is b/c in Sazed latest translation, whomever is writing it seems to have changed his mind about Alendi(I think that is his name) being the HOA.  Whatever reasons he once had for supporting him obviously changed.  So maybe hearing the pulses does not mean that you are the HOA, just that you are being used by The Deepness to further its own goals.  Or it could just be that The Deepness is feeling threatened by Alendi and is manipulating the Terrisman writer in order to destroy him before he can kill it I suppose.

Now I am confusing myself lol. 

Vintage

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2008, 11:22:56 AM »
I already mentionned the fact that Elend could very well be. Not only because Brandon seems vague about it(now, I haven't read all of the annotations, but a good part up to now), but simply because there is too many whys not answered in regard to him. Some of the main ones are : Why does he have to learn to be a leader - well, yes, anyone might have done the job beside this young puppy ; Why does he need to be a Full Mistborn for - the attact of the Mist Spirit seems to well coordinate just to be a coincidence - it had several occasions of killing Elend when Vin was busy rescuing Luthadel if it was its real purpose. Moreover, there was to be glory for the one who would discover the Hero and what more of it if it comes not only to discover the Hero but to give him the reason to show himself ? Thus liberating the well spirit to better strike it ?

The question to ask is "Why ?" A lot of life mystery are solved only by answering this very simple question. It would only be logical that a lot of mystery would be solved by answering this simple question at looking at the Well of Ascension. Mind you, we won't know for sure before Mistborn 3 is out. Everything in between is simple divagation (or puzzle type of mystery).

Chaos

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2008, 03:40:19 PM »
I would say that Alendi and Vin weren't really the HoAs, just because it's all an intense ploy by Ruin to free himself. The question is, then, what is the Hero actually supposed to do, before Ruin did all that toying with the prophecies?

(If you don't know about Ruin, read the Ruin and Preservation topic on page two of the BS forum).
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darxbane

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2008, 04:21:01 PM »
More to the point, if the Hero prophecy is entirely made up to by Ruin, then there really isn't a Hero of Ages.  Irrespective of that, Vin is the central character of this story.  I feel safe in saying that if there is a Hero of Ages, it is Vin.
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Vintage

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2008, 05:54:55 PM »
I do not think the prophecy was made entirely by ruin otherwise there would have been no necessity, no need of corrupting it. And it was changed and not only to make Alendi fit into it, not only his character, but also what he should be doing. If the Well's power could have been liberated differently, it would have remain as vague, but maybe the time is getting dearest to.

Chaos

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2008, 07:06:30 PM »
Also, Ruin doesn't actually "create" things, per se. He manipulates so he can destroy more. It wouldn't be his nature to completely create fake prophecies... but making them "more" fake, yes. He seems clever enough to be able to do that.
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darxbane

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2008, 08:54:11 PM »
How do we know it's not in It's nature?  If it could take a story like "A long time ago in a galaxy far, far, away" and change it to "It's far past time for this galaxy to be destroyed", why couldn't it slowly plant a seed of a prophecy.  It even has the advantage of being able to change it at will, so It doesn't even have to be vague enough for people to think a part has been fulfilled. 
I wanted to write something profound here, but I couldn't think of anything.

Comatose

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2008, 08:56:25 PM »
I like the Elend theory, it has merit, but i still think there' something special about vin, she's just too powerful, a point that has been well observed by many characters in the book, and I think it's more than just her earing.  She isn't just powerful, she's skillful at allomancy, she is able to pick it all up easily, like she learned it before.
But the Elend thing is just such a great twist, it's hard to say no to.
What if there is more than one hero?
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2008, 09:34:33 PM »
But isn't she noticing the pulses are really far away and not at all where it actually ends up being?
In the first drafts of the book, the Well was not located under Kredik Shaw. Instead, it was in the north like everyone assumed it was. For good narrative and plot reasons, Brandon's agent (or was it his editor?) suggested changing the location of the well. This was a really good idea; the last part of the book reads much more smoothly now than it did in the first drafts.

So the stuff about Vin sensing pulses far to the north had to be re-explained a bit. They weren't really far to the north; they were coming from Kredik Shaw the whole time, and Vin just happened to be south of Kredik Shaw most of the time. They felt distant at first only because the pulses were so weak at first. Still, it's a little bit more clunky now, and I don't recall any hint in the story that Vin notices any change in the direction of the pulses when she's in different parts of the city.

When Vin and Elend go north of the city, she starts feeling the pulses from the south (the direction of Kredik Shaw) and it really confuses her. ^_^

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Comatose

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2008, 11:29:41 PM »
Really?  That would have made quite a different story I think, had the well ACTUALLY been in the north.

I quite like how the well ends up being under kredik shaw, and it definately makes sense.  That would have changed the ending a lot.

Although, it would have changed the book just as much as clubs being a smoker instead of a seeker.
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Peter Ahlstrom

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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2008, 01:10:51 AM »
The end result was more or less the same, just with some things in a different order. It works better the way it is in the published version.
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Re: Vin as HOA?
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2008, 07:57:03 PM »
And it made a really good twist!
"Look, I'm just trying to change the world, okay?  I don't have time for a grudge match with every poser in a parka!"
- Dr. Horrible

"There's always another secret..."
- Kelsier