Teddy Roosevelt was Spider-man

[42]

Okay, I've been playing around with the idea of creating a super hero campaign, but outside of the modern era. I'd like to set the campaign in late-19th century Industrial America.

So I'm having trouble deciding what system to use. I like Palladiums Heros Unlimited, but it's just not working with the time era change. The whole education and equipment sections get too mucked up.

So I'm wondering what suggestions people have.

The systems that I have found don't work, or would be too much work to adapt:
Palladium
Feg-Shui
Nobilis
White Wolf

Systems that I'm considering, or haven't yet checked out:
D20 (Drawing a lot from Modern & Cthulu)
Hackmaster
GURPS
Hero 5th
Space 1889

It still seams like a lot of work, no matter what I choose. There just doesn't seem to be any RPGs set in that time period.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

Have you checked out Godlike (which seems to be pretty popular right now) or WEG's d6 Heroic system (as contained in their DCU rpg?) It seems like the hardest part is coming up with price lists, etc, and placing limits on powers, as in comics heroes typically weren't as out of control in the golden age (20-30 years after the time you're talking about) as they are today (even superman was weaker).

To be honest, Hackmaster is probably your worst choice here. You'd have to create coimpletely new classes, which includes entire new sets of rules. Their current system is very unlikely to work for a fast-paced action theme (yes, there's a lot of combat, but like AD&D 1st ed, it's slow).

I'm not familiar with Space 1889 or Hero, but GURPS has a decent enough supers supplement already in place. I'm not using it, and I could bring it out and loan it to you on an extended basis if you wish (when I come in a week or so). D20 would take more work than GURPS, but might be rewarding enough to make it work, just for the less tedious-ness in everything. Though it seems to me that Feng Shui would actually take less adaptation than d20 would.

[Entsuropi]

A question:

Why would you even consider Nobilis? It only adapts to the Matrix due to its Aspect rules and the fact that you can VERY easily adapt the matrix concepts (especially in reloaded..) to fit in with Nobilis.

It just seems... bizarre for superheros.

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

Im not convinced why you think Feng Shui would be so hard to adapt either. Its almost comic booky enough as is. Since the special effects and look of powers, fu or guns are pretty much up to the player though its really easy to fiddle with.

Want a X-men style mutant who can shoot lasers out of his eyes get a sctick in Blast Sorcery or allow them to take the path of the Brilliant flame and rename eyes of fire to Laser eyes!!!.

Just have the players tell you what type they want to play and adjust the templates.  Big Bricks like the Hulk could use the Abomination or Supernatural Creature and Bump up the body big time.... Bricks could take the Big Bruiser Type.... and theres already a fully functional Masked Avenger (batman type anyone)

Heck Spiderman could even be a transformed Animal with the Schticks of Leap, Scuttle, Tingle and Web!

Sabertooth (tiger)or wolverine could use the fu sctick (path of the bear)

If guns seem to be a problem remember that they are also abstracted later on with damage set aside by bullet type.... Small handgun- really big handgun- heavy rifle etc...
Have the players do all the research for you too. If they want an 1898 Schofield revolver have them figure out what caliber it is how big it is (in inches) and how many shots it fires...
Oh and keep the shotgun rule for pump shotguns and extend it to winchesters!

Honestly if you want to do a superhero game this is the one to do it in....

Plus the game comes with different time periods built in.

For cool info on racing horses check out Golden Comeback.

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

Space 1889 is entirely unsuitible. It would take a monumental job to make it work...

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

White wolf could work if you got a copy of either Wraith the Great War or Werewolf Wild West and Aberrant.

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

What kind of work do you mean by the way...
Historical research, rules or a combination of the two?
Its important because your not going to find many games set when you want it. Rules wise Hero takes a lot of work to set up.... but once its going it runs really smoothly... D20 would be like that too only less flexible for a hero style game.
Gurps Could be done... but again much work is needed. Player creation alone can take hours.

FS takes almost no set up time and can be adapted pretty quickly but doesn't give you much depth. (Guns are mainly props, and schticks are kind of cartoony)

WW is more story oriented...Adventure could be fun to adapt and its closer to the time period anyway... but if you dont like storyteller then thats a bust. Hackmaster would be a monumental challenge and pretty pointless the fun of hackmaster is HACKMASTER, maybe Kenzer will come out with Hero's and Zero's but dont hold your breath.

Palladium doesn't seem that hard to do either... even equipment wise. Skills can be changed very easily as can education and since 90% of that crap is just background anyway....

[Fellfrosch]

I don't know Feng Shui, but it sounds like it could work. I also think that D20 Modern would work really well, because the classes are so flexible.

Or just wait a couple of months until the obligatory d20 rules for "League of Extraordinary Gentlemen" come out. That would work perfectly.

[Mad Dr Jeffe]

I think any game about that subject will take some work!!!

But the idea is cool kinda like LXG but with an american slant... John Henry, Johnny Appleseed, Paul Bunyon, Pecos Bill, etc...

[42]

I don't think you understand the time period place I'm heading for. It's not the WWI or the roaring twenties. It's not Victorian, it's not the Wild West.

This is industrial America, there is almost no middle-class. The wealthy are opulent, the poor are oppessed.
There are few to no cars, some telegraphs, photography is just starting to become afforadble and there are no really modern weaponry.
Worker's rights are struggling to be recognized, there is no welfare and public schooling is struggling to get started.

I guess there is also the problem that I don't run combat heavy campaigns. In my sort of games, Wolverine and Cyclops usually get the short end of the stick compaired to heros like Shadowcat or Jean Grey.
I also think that Cyclops is a really lame super-hero, but that's another discussion.

My campaigns tend to be very skills heavy and focus a lot on problem solving. Hence the Palladium Education system becomes problematic because things like background are important.

I guess depth is important to me, so hence I've discounted Feng Shui and some other RPGs that are fairly simplistic.

So I guess Hackmaster and Space 1889 are out. That leaves D20, GURPS and Hero.

[42]

Okay, I've been looking at some GURPS stuff. I'm thinking I might have an RPG three-way using D20 Modern mechanics with Palladium Heroes Unlimited and GURPS Timeline as resources.

Is that just sick and wrong?

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

yeah, it is. However, I think the problem with this discussion is that no one is anywhere clear what you're asking. it seems to me you are asking what system would work for super-powers in  industrial America. well, many of them would. It's just a question of coming up with equipment lists. You want something that will extensively with skills and interpersonal reactions, well, that's not typical superhero stuff is it. You need to explain that before we can give you answers you want.

[42]

Well, I want skills that reflects the time period. A lot of weren't literate, there are no computers, but it's not quite the dark ages either with things like medicine bringing forth big discoveries.

Like I said I'm going for quite a bit of depth. I would like to be able to interplay how having super-powers would change things in this time period. Say for ecample, what do you do when you discover that your a coal miner how can read minds, but can't read books.

I tried doing this with Palladium creating super-heroes for each decade starting with the present and heading backwards by each decade. Everything was great until I got past WWI where there suddenly appeared a gap unitil the Reconstruction Era after the Civil War. It is a little hard to define what a super-hero would be like in the industrial period. Partly because the US didn't have a whole lot with the exception of people like Teddy Roosevelt and Little Orphan Anne.

So I guess I'm taking the perspective of making a Super-Hero for the time period rather than just placing super heroes in an arbitrary time period.

[The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers]

I see. I think perhaps the lack of example heroes is because we weren't a major player yet and a lot of the period isn't that great a time for us. We're beginning to see science above magic ans superstition.

[Brian]

Seems to me pretty much any semi-universal, full-range system that has rules for super hero like abilities would work great, as long as you come up with your own list of equipment and skills to reflect the time period. Which is going to be a must anyway.

For instance, the system Fellfrosch is using for the Patriot City game would work -- I don't know the system at all, heck I don't even know for sure which one he's using (is it Palladium Heroes Unlimited?), but it seems to me that mucking with the equipment/skills shouldn't be too hard, and considering that the Public Education System hasn't really changed much in the last 150 years, I'm not sure I understand where the challenge lies.