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Messages - Omelethead

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16
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 06, 2010, 04:20:52 AM »
There's no way they did all this to get one Shardsuit. It was not the goal, a goal, or even something they were hoping for.

I don't think anyone thinks they killed Gavilar for the Blade and Plate.  But just because they have their own sets, doesn't mean they wouldn't also like another set.  Also, as someone else said, they could have checked on Szeth's handiwork and noticed the Blade and then took the Blade.  That's not my personal theory (I like the Shallan idea), but I do think is a valid theory.

I'm sure they'd like another set, but they couldn't reasonably expect to get Gavilar's. Making off with his Plate would be unbelievably difficult. It would require armies to hold the Alethi off while they stripped Gavilar and carted it out. His Blade would be easier, but there's no way for them to be first to the scene, beating Gavilar's guards and countrymen.

If they wanted Plate, they could have invited Highprinces out for Greatshell hunts. And had "accidents".

I 'm sticking with what I said. The Parshendi had no expectation or hope to get ahold of Gavilar's Shards. It just wasn't in their plans. If they had thought ahead, they might have commanded Szeth to recover any Shardblades he happened across, but it's easy to see how they forgot. They were worried about bigger things at the time.

And even if the set Dalinar won on the plains was given to Elhokar to give to whoever he wanted, it still doesn't answer where Gavilar's set is now.

Very true. It's a good question. I think Elhokar inherited Gavilar's Plate, but that's just a personal theory.

17
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 06, 2010, 01:27:05 AM »
It never actually says if they took it or not or if they even needed Szeth to do anything.  Whatever their motives for killing Gavilar, getting a Shardblade at the same time seems like a good deal.
Sure, the Blade/Plate probably wasn't their main goal, but we can't say it wasn't one of their goals.

I think it pretty definitely wasn't one of their goals. How would they have managed it without specifically instructing Szeth? They're going to sneak someone else close to the king's body before any of his advisors get there to hurry and grab the Blade? No way. I'm sure they would have asked Szeth to steal the Blade if they had thought of it or fully understood what Truthless of Shinovar meant. They're probably not going to turn down a Blade if it comes their way (though they just might, since that is what they did by letting Dalinar and Adolin walk away, by fighting fair. They might not believe in stealing an assassinated man's Blade), but they wouldn't sign a treaty and send an assassin that same night just for a Blade.

They wanted to kill Gavilar. They probably didn't think Szeth would even have to battle a Shardbearer to death. It was a surprise for Gavilar to be the one in the Plate, remember. They wanted Szeth to get the king, hopefully avoiding any Shardbearers along the way, but getting past them if he needed to.

There's no way they did all this to get one Shardsuit. It was not the goal, a goal, or even something they were hoping for.

18
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 05, 2010, 10:54:59 PM »
Why would the Parshendi Shardbearer have Gavilar's Blade/Plate? The book mentions that the Parshendi had their own Shardbearers, so when we finally meet one, why do we assume it's not just a "regular" Shardbearer?
Because the Parshendi had Gavilar killed and we don't know where his Plate or Blade are, hence this whole thread.
But they didn't have him killed for his Plate and Blade! They didn't give Szeth any special instructions, never told him to make sure and take the Blade or to leave the Plate as intact as possible. They weren't interested in his Blade and Plate, they had their own sets.

As far as I can remember, Dalinar only captured one set of Parshendi Shardplate, which he gave to Elhokar to divvy up. Dalinar didn't give it to Elhokar, but let him decide who got it, to honor him as king. Elhokar gave it out, we don't know where. The other Highprinces don't bother sending their captured Shards to the king, but give them to their own men, something Dalinar later decided to do with Renarin.

If you had read the quotes I linked earlier in this thread, you'd see that the actual passages related to those things are ambiguous as to if Dalinar gave a set of Blade and Plate to Elhokar to keep or to use.

As Erunion pointed out though, Elhokar could have already had his own set of Plate and Blade before Gavilar died, but just because Dalinar and Gavilar defeated the other Alethi shardbearers does not neccessarily mean they killed the other shardbearers.  They were fighting other Alethi after all with the goal of uniting all the Alethi.  That would be hard to do if they went around taking all the Alethi Blades and Plate.

I didn't think they were that ambiguous. Dalinar let Elhokar decide who to award the Shardplate to. He would have mentioned it if Elhokar owed Dalinar for his Shards, especially when Dalinar was drilling some sense into Elhokar's head at the end.

19
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 05, 2010, 08:56:44 PM »
Stormblessed, Dalinar gives Elhokar two sets of plate and blade captured from the parshendi. Elhokar gave them to the two warriors that were most worthy of the gear. This was likely a political move, to encourage unity in the warcamps and enhance the kingly image of Elhokar, the king being the one who provides honour and security to his subjects. The idea of giving gear to Renarin is a new one. Isn't Renarin 20? If so, he would have been 15 at the time that Dalinar gave out the gear. Add this to his "blood weakness" whatever that may be, and he would be, in the minds of most Alethi, clearly unsuited to bearing shards.

As far as I can remember, Dalinar only captured one set of Parshendi Shardplate, which he gave to Elhokar to divvy up. Dalinar didn't give it to Elhokar, but let him decide who got it, to honor him as king. Elhokar gave it out, we don't know where. The other Highprinces don't bother sending their captured Shards to the king, but give them to their own men, something Dalinar later decided to do with Renarin.

Of those, I think that Elhokar or Sadaes has the plate, and that the Parshendi Shardbearer has the blade. Their is, of course, one objection to the Parshendi having the blade; Dalinar would likely have recognized it. That then makes Shallan just as likely a candidate for holding the blade. Perhaps her father was in Alethkar as a traveling dignitary, and he was tipped off by the ghostbloods, followed Szeth and took the blade?

Why would the Parshendi Shardbearer have Gavilar's Blade/Plate? The book mentions that the Parshendi had their own Shardbearers, so when we finally meet one, why do we assume it's not just a "regular" Shardbearer?

20
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 05, 2010, 04:02:09 PM »
Then Sadeas has to step up and be all "I remember the Assassin in White, it wasn't this chick," or, in an even more evil step because ruining Shallan somehow undermines Dalinar, saying "I remember exactly the Assassin in White, and it was DEFINITELY this chick."

I think it's well known that the Assassin in White was Shin. Sadeas wasn't the only one to see him, and with Szeth's recent exploits and assassinations around the continent, no one is going to suspect Shallan of being the AiW.

21
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Gavilier (spoiler)
« on: October 05, 2010, 03:36:49 AM »
Crazy theory time: If Elhokar's Blade and Plate aren't from Gavilar, then Shallan has Gavilar's Blade. Someone from her father's organisation happened on the king's body, stole his Blade while it sat there, and made off with it. Then the Blade made it's way into Shallan's dad's hands, and then Shallan. Heck, maybe Shallan's dad happened on Gavilar's body.

Dalinar and the rest of the Alethi thought the Assassin in White took the Blade, but didn't have the time to steal the Plate.

Does Elhokar's plate match the description of Gavilar's? It might be that Elhokar got his dad's Plate, but no Blade, and when Dalinar gave him the Parshendi Plate and Blade, Elhokar took the Blade and passed on the Plate (to Sadeas?).

I don't know. I can't remember all the descriptions of the Plate, or if Sadeas had his Plate the whole time.


But Shallan's Blade is Gavilar's. If Elhokar doesn't have it.

</crazy theory>

22
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Medical Hemalurgy
« on: October 03, 2010, 05:47:50 AM »
The ironic would be that the process has actual historical basis for being evil.

But with the whole change in leadership, evil is good!

23
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Medical Hemalurgy
« on: October 03, 2010, 04:08:45 AM »
Don't you have to kill someone to make a Hemalurgic spike?
Or harvest from a dying person, just like organ donation.
Organs are only taken after a person is dead. You don't actually kill them for their organs.

Yes, but a person's body is kept on life support after they die in order to harvest the organs. They could leave a person on life support, then spike them.

It would probably be a very controversial subject in their society (much like organ donation can be in ours). It just might require the donor to be euthanized . The whole process just needs to be regulated and voluntary.

24
Brandon Sanderson / Re: A use for Aluminum
« on: October 02, 2010, 04:29:23 PM »
Shortly after Hero of Ages was released, Brandon revealed in a Q&A thread (which is apparently no longer stickied) here that, while pretty much all actual feruchemists were killed by the Steel Inquisitors in Hero of Ages, feruchemy remained in the Terris bloodlines.  The death of all those feruchemists plus interbreeding with other peoples diluted the feruchemical heritage to the point where the abilities split and started producing feruchemical mistings.  Thus, by the time of the planned sequel trilogy several hundred years later, single-metal users would be common for both magic systems, and occasionally someone would have both allomantic and feruchemical ability, each with one metal.  If the metals happen to be the same, then that person would be able to pull off The Lord Ruler's trick with that particular metal.

Some metal combinations do work with different metals though.

25
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Medical Hemalurgy
« on: October 02, 2010, 04:26:25 PM »
Don't you have to kill someone to make a Hemalurgic spike?

Or harvest from a dying person, just like organ donation.

I'm guess pewter would be the only medical "transplant". Unless they gave blind people tin spikes, either to cure near blindness or to beef up the other senses.

I wonder if wills would include hemalurgic spiking. So if a misting is on their deathbed, they get spiked to let their children inherit. Or if they pass down a hemalurgic spike they were using, even if it would lose potency.

Awesome idea.  ;D

26
Brandon Sanderson / Re: A use for Aluminum
« on: September 29, 2010, 04:51:11 AM »
Those metals in your blood would be too diluted to be affected. Those in your stomach are just sitting there in hugeish lumps (relative to the metal in the rest of your body). That's why its easy to target and remove them.

But then that wouldn't help much if an Aluminum misting were working with toxic metals. The metals wouldn't be in lumps in their stomach, they'd be on their skin and then their blood.

Maybe aluminum just targets metals that are allomantic alloys. So iron or other trace metals in your bloodstream wouldn't be in allomantic form, and wouldn't be affected.

Course, hazardous metals in a workplace would be fairly unlikely to be in allomantic alloys, so that doesn't help much either.

27
Brandon Sanderson / Re: *Spoilers* General Shard List
« on: September 28, 2010, 03:53:20 AM »
I'm re-reading Elantris again and I'm like whoa. There are so many religions, but none of them seem to be linked directly to a shard. Are the religions independed of the shards, or are there other shards on Sel we don't know about. Or maybe some shards came and left like Odium did?

But then again, there is some similarity between Jesker and Aona, mainly that of the Dor. But in addition, I have a theory that Aona put her shard essence into the land, which is why there is such a strong connection between the land and the aons (thus the roed occured when aona's shard was shattered). If this is true, then it would be similar to Jaddeth who is imprisoned in the rock.

So in the end I am really confused.  ???

Religions don't have to be tied to Shards. There could be multiple interpretations of one Shard, or a religion that incorporates multiple Shards (somewhat like the Kandra, who know of both Ruin and Preservation), or a religion that springs up completely separately.

And in Elantris, Shu-Dereth and Shu-Korath (IIRC) were both interpretations of a central religion/figure (the one from whom Jesker and Dula religion comes from).

It would be nice to match Shards to religions, but it's not a sure thing.

28
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Splinters - SPOILERS for TWoK and Elantris
« on: September 27, 2010, 07:26:06 PM »
I've thought about this some more, and now I want to know why Ruin didn't splinter Preservation. If anyone could destroy or maim a Shard, you'd think it'd be Ruin. Then he wouldn't have to worry about anyone rising up and ruining his plans like Vin did.

If he was worried about destroying himself in the process, then how did Odium do it? Did he use his power of hate to convince Aona and Skai to Splinter each other?

29
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Splinters - SPOILERS for TWoK and Elantris
« on: September 24, 2010, 03:36:15 PM »
My understanding was that Sazed could take both shards because every living creature on that planet (can't recall the mistborn planet sorry) was created by both shards in tandem, and thus everyone was part preservation and part ruin. Therefore they were "compatible" with both. I can't remember the line specifically but I got that impression from a scene with Vin after she had absorbed the preservation shard. She though to herself something along the lines that Laras (preservation) had specifically planned this sequence of events because he needed someone who was both ruin and preservation to destroy Ati.

But maybe I read into the entire thing wrong

This is a good point. However, Odium was worried about someone taking up Aona and Skai's Shards. So it is possible, and it sounds to me he was worried about another Shardholder gaining power. But I guess he could just be worried about a Sel native.

30
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Splinters - SPOILERS for TWoK and Elantris
« on: September 24, 2010, 02:27:34 AM »
For the same reason Ruin didn't take Preservation's shard.

I thought that was because Ruin was the antithesis of Preservation, and so he really couldn't. Sazed hadn't been twisted/converted or changed by a Shard yet so he could grab both.


Neither Shard from Elantris sounded like the opposite of Odium, but I guess this explanation does help.

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