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Messages - Czanos

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211
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Reen's obsidian
« on: July 23, 2008, 07:40:49 AM »
The forums here consider the earring important because Vin's mother gave it to her after messily killing her sister.  Sorta like Marsh got spikes staked through him after several people were messily killed.

The bottom line is that Vin seems to have several powers that seem to be related to hemalurgy, not least of which is the ability to pierce copper-clouds.  The earring would then be a piercing, like the inquisitors spikes, which somehow give or maintain this power.  The sacrifice to give her this power would be her sister.  Thats why the earring has gotten all the forum-time, especially because we understand so little about hemalurgy.

However I'm intrigued by the notion that Reen knew enough about Allomancy to keep a non-Allomantic weapon handy.  That may well be meaningful as well.

I'm not so sure we should dismiss Vin's earring being a red herring so easily. Is it stated anywhere for sure that piercing copper clouds is a Hemalurgic ability? It could be something akin to not being able to affect metals in someone's body, but with less of a strength barrier. All the people who can pierce copper clouds are very Allomantically powerful in and of their own right, and Marsh even tells Vin when he's first training her that most Allomancers dismiss Bronze as one of the weakest powers.

Of course, Vin is strange in other ways as well, so the mystery continues . . .

And Miyabi, when the Inquisitors are interrogating Vin at the end of Mistborn one, I'm pretty sure they mention that they captured Reen and tortured him to death trying to extract Vin's whereabouts. It's true they could have been lying, but I can't see a very good motive for them to make up such an unhelpful story.

212
Brandon Sanderson / Re: The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread
« on: July 15, 2008, 04:59:10 AM »
Quote
He stepped forward. Though he could no longer see as normal men did--after all, he had large steel spikes driven point-first through his eyes--he could sense the room around him.

From the Mistborn 3 Prologue, but it's mentioned in several places that the eye spikes are indeed Steel.

213
I think that probably Ruin's influence has more do to with how close the Well is to being full. As it approaches the end of it's millennial cycle, Ruin gains more power to enact upon the world. He begins to be able to whisper in Hemalurgist's minds, and when the Well is almost full, take control of their bodies. However, when the Lord Ruler was alive and in power, I think he had a much larger hold on the Inquisitor's minds than Ruin did, and Ruin would have had to be very subtle in his limited manipulations of them.

214
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Ruin and Preservation
« on: July 11, 2008, 03:30:25 AM »
I'm more inclined to think that Hemalurgy is the newest of the magic systems. Perhaps the Lord Ruler made Hemalurgy for his Inquisitors, and just happened upon Allomancy while he was doing it.

215
Preservation is helping the Lord Ruler preserve things would be my guess. With the Lord Ruler in complete control, Preservation is basically given free reign to preserve everything it can, thus leading to the stagnation of society others have mentioned.

Also, perhaps it is not Mistborn who are of Ruin, but humans in general. Humans were around far before the Ascension, and so could have been created by Ruin long before he was imprisoned.

I forgot about that quote, Reaves, and now that I think about it, it might have just been more of what went on before Vin freed Ruin. Nobody went to the Well though, so Ruin slowly started seeping around the edges, changing metalminds and sending the deepness upon the world. Without a Hero of Ages to take the power in the Well and use it themselves, Ruin could possibly tap slightly into it and use it to weaken his prison. Then Rashek went to the Well, took the power, re-imprisoned Ruin as strong as ever, and sat back to wait for the next time he would need to go to the Well of Ascension.

216
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Vin's Mom
« on: July 11, 2008, 01:03:42 AM »
Doesn't Vin state that her mom was a ska? He father was the one that provided the noble blood.

Yes, but if her mom knew Vin had noble blood, (I would hope she did,) then she would know that there was a good chance Vin would have Allomancy. By preforming the ritual to grant Vin Hemalurgy as well, she was ensuring her daughter would be quite powerful in her own right. She was rambling on about her being a princess because to her that meant she would have the powers of Allomancy.

And as for the others, I think the only genetic difference between noblemen and skaa is the genetic trait of Allomancy. When the Lord Ruler took power, he gave his closest supporters the metal that creates Mistborn, imbedding within them the genetic trait to pass down Allomancy. They are genetically different, but only by a very little amount. (Otherwise, there would be no way for noblemen and skaa to interbreed, which obviously happens.)

217
Brandon Sanderson / Re: The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread
« on: July 11, 2008, 12:50:55 AM »
It does seem to fit in quite well with my theory of Hemalurgy. By tapping into the latent abilities in the blood, one could use Allomancy and Feruchemy, (if those traits were in your blood,) not have to worry about killing yourself by using too much Hemalurgy, and satisfies Brandon's condition that each of the magic systems draws the power from a different source. (Hemalurgy = Blood, Feruchemy = stored traits from one's body, Allomancy = the metals themselves.)

218
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Vin's Mom
« on: July 11, 2008, 12:47:48 AM »
Could tie in to the noble blood deal with Allomancy. Her mom might have known that she would be special if she had both Hemalurgy and Allomancy to work off of.

219
Brandon Sanderson / Re: The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread
« on: July 11, 2008, 12:43:48 AM »
It could be like Feruchemy in a way, where it taps into a latent source within the blood, but does not actually consume the blood itself.

220
Well, the way I see it, before the Ascension, Ruin was free, much like he is after Vin frees him. Yet he still cannot act unchecked against the world, as Preservation is also freed. Then, at the Well of Ascension, Rashek used the power to imprison Ruin and tap into the power of Preservation. He created the Kandra and Koloss, at least one of which believes itself to be "from" preservation. He then proceeds to do what he can with Allomancy, Hemalurgy, and Feruchemy to insure that he is the only one who will ever be able to access the Well of Ascension, ensuring that Ruin stays trapped forever.

It also ties in to the theory that the state of the world affects which power has the most influence at the moment, if you look at it the right way. (Or it could just be coincidence/another factor that made the Lord Ruler preserve so much in the world.) He was trying to preserve society, and weaken Ruin's influence to less than nothing. He culled out the Keepers because he saw the potential dangers of mixing Feruchemy with Allomancy and/or Hemalurgy, and I assume he used one of his many abilities to override Ruin's control over the Inquisitors. (Or he just didn't know.) He could rule them with an iron fist, control their numbers, and (if he used something like his impressive soothing to ensure control,) limit the power of Ruin by keeping most of his agents close to him.

221
Brandon Sanderson / Re: The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread
« on: July 11, 2008, 12:33:33 AM »
We have no hard evidence that Hemalurgy burns the blood away, but from the latin root, various quotes in the books about Hemalurgy being messy, and possibly including the fact that inquisitors have to rest often, it is most often assumed that Hemalurgy uses the blood in some manner. Whether or not the blood is actually burned up is something we don't really have enough information to pursue. (I think not, but I'm nowhere near sure.)

222
Brandon Sanderson / Re: The Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread
« on: July 11, 2008, 12:10:04 AM »
The only problem I have with the blood transfusion theory is that eventually they would run out of the blood that contained the certain power. They usually give misting the hooks right? Maybe they use the hook and replace one of the spikes that is in their body... OR took the organs from the other person and put them into a new SI (looking for a kidney donor... hahahaha, but prologue ruins that one...) that would satisfy ruins love for pain :) 2 in the lungs 1 in the heart 1 in the pancreas 2 in the kidneys 1 in the liver the 2 in the eyes 1 linch pin... vital organs in the torso anyone?

Back to this point, I was thinking that the Inquisitors might not use up the blood, but either use up the metals within the blood or some resevoir within the blood like in Feruchemy. Thus the Allomantic and Feruchemical powers they wish to use are always contained within their blood, just not the power to use their Hemalurgical abilities. (Like how a metal that used to have a Feruchemical storage in it cannot be used for Feruchemy unless it is refilled, but it can always be used for Allomancy via burning.)

This way, because Hemalurgists have the ability to tap into power stored within their blood, and they have Allomantic blood, they can always tap into their Allomancy, but it would still require burning metals to use Allomancy. (Of course, they may be able to just burn off the metals already in their bodies for the Hemalurgy. It then becomes competing resources, on if one would want to use the blood storages  for Allomantic or Hemalurgic purposes.) Then because the two systems draw from different sources, Hemalurgy from the reservoir within your blood or your blood itself, and Allomancy directly from the metal, they can be used in conjunction from one source of metal.  (And you could theoretically add in Feruchemy, letting you draw power from your own body, store it in the metals affecting your blood, and possibly burn those blood metals via Allomancy. I have no idea what benefit this would give you, but it shows all three systems working in tandem.)

And as for the organ conversation, I would agree on most of the organ choices, and Stomach would come to me first, but my question is on whether or not the piercing has to go through a specific organ in the sacrifice, in the Inquisitor to be, or both?

As for the pulses, I would assume that those are either a power of Hemalurgy, or a power of an Allomancy/Hemalurgy combination. Ruin could also just be using his probably Hemalurgy connection to make Vin "hear" the pulses in her mind. (And our newest beat box champion is . . . Ruin! Destroyer of Worlds!)


223
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Vin's Mom
« on: July 10, 2008, 07:02:34 PM »
Then we shall continue this in the Comprehensive Hemalurgy thread. (Though I'm willing to admit Vin probably got her Mistborn abilities through the normal method, there's more to this theory than that.)

As for Vin's mom being a Hemalurgist, I agree it's quite possible, but it makes me ask the question of just who can make a Hemalurgist. Has it been confirmed that the one preforming the process of sacrificing has to be a Hemalurgist? If so, how were the first Hemalurgists made? I find it more plausible that anyone could do it, with the right know-how and tools. (Though it does seem kind of odd that a non-Hemalurgist could make a Hemalurgist through Hemalurgy, but that could be explained in the same way that a non-Allomancer could become an Allomancer through Allomantically burning the metal Elend ate. However they explain that.)

Of course, Vin's mom having Hemalurgy would explain the voices in her head, so it's probably true.

224
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Vin's Mom
« on: July 10, 2008, 06:45:40 PM »
Read my post on the bottom of page 21 in the Comprehensive Hemalurgy Thread. I am well aware of the discussion's about Hemalurgy "giving" Allomancy, and I believe that gaining Allomancy from your sacrifice would just be an added perk if the sacrifice happened to have Allomantic blood which seeped into you.

It's almost like the Lord Ruler burning his Feruchemical attributes through Allomancy. He got his special powers because he Allomantically burned a special source of metal. In this case, Vin obtained the abilities of a Mistborn by Hemalurgically using a special source of blood. By tapping into her sister's Allomantic blood in her body via Hemalurgy, she gains access to the Mistborn abilities. It would explain why Inquisitors can use all the different metals, because they have a wide variety of misting/Mistborn sacrifices to use when impaling themselves for Hemalurgy.

So basically, gaining the Allomantic (or Feruchemical?) abilities through Hemalurgy is just a perk in addition to gaining Hemalurgy, and it depends on who's blood you have flowing through you.

Almost forgot, about the Bronze/ear issue, it's true we came to a general consensus, but that proves very little. It could go both ways, but I have to agree it's probably the bronze doing it. (Though then why would the prologue's bronze spike go through the heart? Maybe all piercings have to go through the heart. Of course that would void the organ/power deal, which I liked a little.)

225
Brandon Sanderson / Re: Vin's Mom
« on: July 10, 2008, 06:25:24 PM »
I believe the books just said Vin's sister was brutally murdered by her mom, but I could be wrong. (And that leaves it open to interpretation on whether or not Vin's sister was stabbed with the earring.)

Another thing here that fits in with my theory of Hemalurgy, is that Vin never remembers Snapping. Perhaps Vin was never a Mistborn herself, (Or maybe a misting,) and her sister was one. Then during the process of sacrificing Vin's sister to give Vin Hemalurgy, she obtained Allomancy as well.

Of course, it could also happen as Kelsier and Vin assume that she just Snapped in one of the many instances of her childhood, and the piercing and blood sacrifice came from Vin's mother. (As the earring used to be worn in her ear, and would pierce it and come into contact with her blood.) This would mean that a Hemalurgic sacrifice would not always have to die, merely be run through with some metal. It also plays off of the whole ear/hearing pulses thing, but that could just be because the earring is in Vin's ear.


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