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Messages - Frog

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Reading Excuses / Re: Email List + Submission Dates
« on: June 29, 2010, 02:01:00 AM »
What's with all the random 'Fred's in my inbox? Are we changing systems or something? You go less active for a moment.... :-[

Reading Excuses / Re: Email List + Submission Dates
« on: May 30, 2010, 10:12:28 PM »
Awwwww, you miss me!
That would require one of us to leave. I haven't posted anything after Jan, so as far as me and my submits are concerned, you're all caught up.

I'm almost done with the novel I'm reading, so I'll be starting your guys' stuff this upcoming week. Then again... Maybe I'll leave it for a while. Wouldn't want Josh to lose his favourite entertainment (that is, taunting me about it) :P
Favourite? :P

Reading Excuses / Re: Email List + Submission Dates
« on: May 30, 2010, 09:33:31 PM »
You would be.

And now he knows the real truth. The only reason anyone would be worried about me, is that they haven't yet experienced the absolute bliss of being corrected by Silk. :P

Reading Excuses / Re: Email List + Submission Dates
« on: May 30, 2010, 09:11:08 PM »
yes, thank you Silk...  ::)

Reading Excuses / Re: Email List + Submission Dates
« on: May 30, 2010, 08:53:20 PM »
Hey all, I'm back and better than ever. My goal? Impress Frog :D
psh. These days getting Frog to even read something would be a feat in and of itself. Fallen off the horse awhile back and it is so hard to get back on. That, and I've noticed that the moment I let myself get into critic mode my ability to write my own new stuff is shot for a day or so and I really want to have something finished. If you think I am tough on your work you should see what a bloody mess I can make of my own stuff.... :P

Welcome back anyway!

Ah, thank you. A little bit of good always helps me take the more negative critical aspects a bit better.
Believe me I understand. I am quickly getting to the point where I can only send my WIP to people who will lie to me and tell me it is perfect just so I can get it done (through the first draft) without ripping it apart myself. It's just that the forum at large usually prefers I am brutally honest and it comes pretty natural to me (more natural then the creative process unfortunately). But if what you need most is more of a cheerleader, I can try to do that too.

I look forward to the aforementioned line edits.
I thought I sent them to your email as an attachment already. Are you saying you didn't get them?

So, uh... was there anything good or that you liked?
Oops, sorry. I know I pointed out a few positive things, but they didn't seem to make it from my line edits to the forum at large. It wasn't a bad start. Though I am not fond of the way you currently formatted the first chapter, it has some good potential as a scene and you did have a lot of good details about the world and magic system that if given in more moderation or shown throughout the scene would have been great.

I think the main reason I might not seem overly enthusiastic about your story right now is that I usually go for the more character and emotionally driven stuff and there simply wasn't a lot of that in these two chapters. In an effort to be more mysterious (I think) you hid most of your character's inner workings and just showed us their current function and abilities. For me, that makes the characters seem more bland, but others may prefer it that way. So I guess it is just up to you to decide what sort of audience you are writing for and adjust accordingly.

And could you also specify what the old English you're referring to is? I don't recall, off hand, putting any in...
Colour instead of color, favourite instead of favorite, crownes instead of crowns... things like that.

Reading Excuses / Re: My elevator speech to Moshe...
« on: April 28, 2010, 11:03:14 PM »
Congrats. Though Chaos is right. Hmmm... I don't think I would want editors anywhere near my MS until I was finished. I have a hard enough time staying motivated after letting you guys go at it. :P

Reading Excuses / Re: 25 Jan 2010 - ryos - To Wish Upon a Dragon
« on: April 28, 2010, 09:26:55 PM »
I'm going to disagree with MKDV because I love fairy tales (which always have morals) and if there wasn't a bit of a moral in there somewhere I might wonder if there is really a point to all this. Now you could make it a bit more subtle if you're afraid of 'preaching,' but I think the overall idea is just fine as is.

You probably are over-narrating though and should probably 'show' much more then you are currently 'telling.' All the rhetorical questions got old pretty quick and I also was confused on the time frame because it seemed like parts were in present tense when the end makes it clear this was written after the fact. I agree with RC and Falcon that it should be consistently a letter if that is what it is.

And again, just to drive you crazy, I will tell you that along with the letter thing not working,  the end was rushed, but probably not quite as badly as in your other two stories.   ;)

Good luck if you decide to summit it. Line edits coming.

Reading Excuses / Re: Progress and Submission Reports
« on: April 28, 2010, 07:50:01 PM »
You're next Ryos (Muhahahaha!)   

Edit: And done. Anyone else? I think I could probably do at least 2-3 more....

I'm done!

First Chp was really hard to get through. I didn't buy the hook line and then there was a lot of unnecessary description. You seem to be telling me all the wrong things, essential details (like how a dronari looks different from a human and some good character motivation) are missing, but then all the colorful details that would be so nice in moderation are on overdrive.

I am afraid that you have fell victim to a pretty classic blunder that is also one of my biggest pet peeves, so it is going to be harder for me to be nice to you (This is your cue to ask me when I've ever been nice. Then I would look all sheepish and admit that I can't think of a time that I was nice either). You have traded actual suspense for cheap confusion. Suspense comes from being able to anticipate something (Don't go in there, because I just know you are going to be attacked by an ax murderer!) and then if you can still surprise us later, so much the better (the ax murder is her boyfriend -duh, duh, dunnnn!).  In this chapter I didn't have any indication of looming trouble nor did I know the players well enough to care either way. Then you cut the scenes so often that even though nothing much was happening in either scene, it was hard to keep straight and at the end we find out you are a highly unreliable narrator that 'lied' to us from the first as far as the timeline goes. You are allowed to show only pieces of the puzzle at the time, but to outright lie ruins your credibility. I'm also not sure if what you reveal at the end is worth all the trouble.

To fix the first chp I would recommend you take Falcon's suggestion as far as the timeline goes, cut down the number of breaks you use and smooth out the remaining transitions, and cut some of the extra description in favor of more character and details more vital to the story at hand.

The next chapter was actually a bit better for me, but I think it would work better if you showed the two leaving rather then telling us father the fact. I know you have some future deal as your big hook at the end, but I would like some hints within these two sections on what your overarching story will be and that there are more layers to your characters to uncover. Something to let me know that there are tons of good things on the way.

More details of your magic system would be nice too (especially if you can show it, not have someone just sit and explain it).

I don't think all the old English added much to your story and would rather you went without since by necessity there are already weird words a plenty. But Ryos, I think, is giving RJ FAR too much credit. If there is no reason to make your common rooms or slang more colorful then the norm, please don't bother. 

I think that is all the big things and I'll be sending you the rest of my line edits. Let me know if you have any questions on any of it. Keep it coming. :)

Reading Excuses / Re: Stealing Plots from Other Genres
« on: April 24, 2010, 02:27:27 PM »
I think that plot isn't the whole story. With any book you write, there should be interesting characters with interesting conflicts. Character, not plot, is the soul of story. Plots are the base distillations of stories, not the stories themselves. Fantasy, in particular, needs to have awesome, differentiating speculative aspects to it as well. So while the basic plot arc may be similar, the other components of the story shouldn't be replicas of your inspiration. If you do that, then yes, you have a problem!
Yeah, basically ditto from me.I don't worry too much about plot 'stealing' so long as you do your own research and insert yourself as much as possible. Let the story evolve a bit on its own rather then trying to rigidly stick to any given formula and it will be better for it. But then most people here know I'm firmly in the  'there is nothing new under the sun' camp. I actually see it as a challenge when people say 'this has never been done before' because it is usually so easy to prove them wrong.  ;D

Reading Excuses / Re: My elevator speech to Moshe...
« on: April 24, 2010, 02:19:36 PM »
Oh, an elevator pitch. You are one brave man. I don't know Moshe, but my suggestion would to be take the idea shivertongue gave you as far as content goes and kill the rhetorical question (generally agents hate them) and insert your own style. If you can make it somewhat humorous (like the book itself) rather then telling me it is comedic that would be even better. Tiny details and some color can go a long way.  I'm also slightly concerned about the wording of the last line  as shivertongue has it. It just seems a bit heavy handed, like you are trying too hard in a bad way.

And are you sure you want to push it to YA? Up to you how you want to sell it, but from what I read I would say it feels more adult style wise, regardless of the characters actual ages.

Good luck. I'll be rooting for you. :D

Reading Excuses / Re: Progress and Submission Reports
« on: April 24, 2010, 02:05:11 PM »
Well, I know I haven't Shivertongue. I'll do your two chapters next (that is all there is, right?). Anyone else?
And yes, falcon. This week would be the week to do it. Get moving.  >:(

Reading Excuses / Re: March 16 - lethalfalcon - Heartglass - Prologue
« on: April 24, 2010, 01:10:51 AM »
I actually thought it was long, but that is just because it is a prologue. Those I take most any excuse to skip because I want the 'real' story. Because this took a few paragraphs to get my attention and such, this would probably be one I would skip in favor of the 1st chp like I did for Eddings, Sanderson and countless others. :P

That being said there did seem to be a good character and story premise in there somewhere. I will agree with Chaos that there was a lot of telling and the dialogue from Roethe got a bit long and stilted. It definitely needs some more emotion and a better hook.

I am curious about some of the new words you are using. There is a danger of using so many without a quick explanation as it becomes more 'irritating' then 'intriguing,' but I don't think you are at that point quite yet.

There might be some line edits in your future, but other then that I would just encourage you to keep pressing on. Your writing is already better then it was and I look forward to seeing more. :)

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