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Departments => Books => Topic started by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 09:22:54 AM

Title: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 09:22:54 AM
K, so November, and NaNoWriMo with it, is over.

Now what?

Well, MoD wanted an online writing group. Since you guys are the ones I trust the most to comment on my work, and since I can't meet with most of you on anything approaching a regular basis, an online groups sounds great. We can either create a forum here, or we can use writers-group.org, which is what i created it for. A mi no me importa.

The first question is, who's in?
The second question is how often?
and then follow other procedural questions. so, who's in?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Dravner on December 01, 2003, 12:15:11 PM
Go ahead and count me in.  This semester's a little tight on time, but that should be clearing up soon.  This'll give me a good push to get back into writing.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 01, 2003, 12:22:09 PM
Yes, I be in as well. I've only two weeks left of this stress filled world. So I can be in.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 01, 2003, 12:28:30 PM
I'm in after the holidays and semester are over--this is my time crunch right now, but it will change dramatically next month.

Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Entsuropi on December 01, 2003, 12:35:34 PM
Free fantasy? Me! Me!
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 01, 2003, 01:17:38 PM
I'm in as well. This leads me to question, however, what our requirements are and how we're going to run this. Does everyone have to submit? Or will it be more of a review board where a large group reads over two or three peoples' stuff?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 01, 2003, 01:24:21 PM
I'd like to be a part of the group too

I think it would be helpful if everyone needs to write. NaNoWriMo got me started, and I think I need some requirements and deadlines to keep me going.

However, will the group only handle fantasy, or could we possibly submit other things such as articles as well? Between Saint, Fell and stacer, I think we have a wide pool of experience and expertise. What do you guys think?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 01:30:36 PM
That's the next question. I think we should have a new chapter each week, possibly two during the week.

I don't suppose that everyone has to submit, though if more than one or two people are carrying it, that would be nice. I aim to start right away, so let's go with people that will participate as of next monday at the latest. If there's room for more, no problem.

I also wonder how we want to discuss it. I suppose a message board is fine, but chat would be more immediate.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 01:32:12 PM
as for genre, I suppose it doesn't matter if people want to submit other than fantasy. However, each person much commit to reading and giving useful comments on every story or chapter. and NO mean comments. I have no problem with nonfiction either.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 01, 2003, 01:44:12 PM
Well, when you say "mean" I assume you are referring to "non constructive", rather than "all comments must be self-esteem boosting"?

Maybe we could schedule a weekly chat session (I suggest MSN because it has the multiple people in one chat session option), and then someone can post to the message board (TWG? or writing-group.org?), if they can't make the chat session for some reason.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Entsuropi on December 01, 2003, 02:09:56 PM
MSN doesnt work for me.

I motion for a IRC chatroom, its the best one for multi person chats.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 01, 2003, 03:14:36 PM
I like IRC. MSN is just a sorts of eyesore for me.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 01, 2003, 04:46:43 PM
I vote for MSN, as I don't know how to use IRC. And I'll be willing to start reading next week, but won't be able to submit till after the 20th or so (when the semester is over). I won't be going home :-[, so I foresee that I'll actually have more time during the holidays than I was thinking.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 01, 2003, 05:15:07 PM
Not going home?? Sad! I did that one year and I don't intend to ever do it again. But what are you going to do without the $$ it takes?

I'm willing to be introduced to IRC, as it is supported by Trillian, but someone is going to have to walk me through it, as I find it all very confusing, and I'm not sure where to start. After I get set up, though, I can help stacer. If, that is, we all decide that IRC is what we want to go with.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 01, 2003, 05:42:27 PM
I vote for AIM, which also does multi-person and which I already use. Since I have no intention of installing MSN or IRC on this machine, that makes me kind of a stick in the mud. But since I've already chatted with just about all of you over AIM at one point or another, I know that you all have it.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 01, 2003, 06:32:52 PM
Well, Trillian (v .74) doesn't allow it for AOL, though I guess Fell could always set up the conversations. It would be much easier than IRC.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 01, 2003, 07:02:34 PM
I'm in if there's room.

I don't know about the whole chat thing, though.  I'll have to educate myself on it.  Chat has been something I've - for one reason or another - stayed away from.  Like cel phones.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 01, 2003, 07:32:25 PM
AIM or IRC I'll use them both. Anything other or, well, no.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 08:04:34 PM
ok, we'll schedule weekly AIM chats.

If you disagree with this decision, tell me now.
Ok, where do we headquarter msg board about it? We could just keep it here, which is easy since everyone already is here. Or we could move it to another board, which would be more private. Thoughts?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 01, 2003, 08:20:34 PM
I used to have AOL, but don't use it anymore. Is it possible to use AIM without having an AOL account? I'm willing to use it, but just am not sure what I need to do so that I don't accidentally re-open my AOL account and they start charging me, you know?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 01, 2003, 08:26:17 PM
stacer, go to the AOL IM Create a Screen Name page (http://my.screenname.aol.com/_cqr/login/login.psp?siteId=aimregistrationPROD&authLev=1&mcState=initialized&createSn=1&triedAimAuth=y). It is not very reliable (aka sometimes it doesn't work properly), but it will get you a free name to use on AOL chat.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 08:45:27 PM
AIM does not require an AOL subscription.

Also, chat works exactly like instant messaging, only with more people involved.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 01, 2003, 11:15:01 PM
Okay, so now I have AIM. But some of you I don't have what your AIM is, so add me to yours, or something--norroway2.

Are we doing this on a particular day of the week?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 01, 2003, 11:53:29 PM
No day of the week yet, we're still cordinating it all.
I don't know that I have an AIM name for Kije. Get set up boy

Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 02, 2003, 12:13:27 AM
So I went to that link and signed up.  "AIM Kije"

So do I have to download the AIM program or something?  Or one of a variety of IM programs?  Or what?  Sorry, I know nothing about this.  I know what chatting is and how it works, I've just never pursued it.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 02, 2003, 12:17:19 AM
Real quick before I go to bed--I vote for Thursday nights if we're going to pick a day of the week. They tend to be the least busy for me.

I was supposed to be in bed an hour ago. grrr.... I can't ever make myself fall asleep. Have an interview first thing that I have to take public transportation to, will take about 1 1/2 hrs to get to, I'm thinking. Sheesh. Gotta be up early for that.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 02, 2003, 12:20:59 AM
yeah, you'll have to download either AIM or one of the other programs that supports AIM. I recommend Trillian, myself.
http://www.ceruleanstudios.com
There's a free version and a "pro" version. The Free one works just fine.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 02, 2003, 12:46:55 AM
OK, got it.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 02, 2003, 10:04:11 AM
I'm fine with thursday's, depending on the time. But I'd much prefer friday, saturday, or monday nights. But if we do this before 11 pm est (my time), then I'm good. Since I like to be in bed around 11 when I have to wake up at 8 am the next morning.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Entsuropi on December 02, 2003, 11:46:24 AM
Whereas i go to bed at 11pm when i am getting up at 6am. Last night i went to bed at midnight for a 6am start. Then i called in sick to work.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 02, 2003, 11:59:09 AM
Thursday is very bad for me. I'm not entirely positive that I can guarantee you the same night every week, but I'll try. Thursday is out, though.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 02, 2003, 12:54:18 PM
ok, not thursday. Is there another night that is just OUT completely? Fridays and Saturday nights are probably not good for most people. Not that I work days, those are date nights.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 02, 2003, 01:04:14 PM
Well, Monday's are difficult. Tuesdays and Wednesdays are probably best for me out of the days provided. For now I'm going to stick with my very unoriginal AOL name, which I have added to my profile.

So it sounds like 8pm MST (10pm EST) would work?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 02, 2003, 01:08:50 PM
Tuesdays are better, but at 10, i don't think it would matter which of those, since my wife would be back from her young woman supervisory activities by then.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Dravner on December 02, 2003, 07:06:31 PM
The more I read of this, the less likely it looks that I'd be able to participate (the lack of permanent net access in a big factor there; I have to use the school labs).

Consider me on hold for now.  I'll see how things develop and then if I'd be able to participate.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 02, 2003, 07:37:20 PM
Well, I think the chats are optional. You could still post your remarks and suggestions to the board. If you could do it before the chat session, even better, because then everyone could take your comments into consideration.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 02, 2003, 07:54:19 PM
So what day is this on?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 02, 2003, 08:39:16 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, we've worked out little else besides the timing of this (which I guess we haven;t worked out either.)  What exactly is going on?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 02, 2003, 09:01:19 PM
the procedure:
the submitter will email all participants his/her chapter/story
the others will make comments on the board
we hold a chat so the writer can get real time comments

Looks like we're doign it Tuesday evenings at 8 MST (10 Eastern). This means the writer should have his out by wed, thurs at the latest. DO we want to do it weekly or bi-weekly?

Where are we maintaining the board? If we're going to have extensive comments on the board, I vote we do it at w-g.org
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 02, 2003, 09:03:06 PM
Okay.  Here, w-g, whatever.

Does everyone submit every week, or just one author?  Or two?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 02, 2003, 09:14:44 PM
I was thinking two. Certainly not everyone. that's too much.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 02, 2003, 09:53:35 PM
2 bi-weekly sounds good.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 02, 2003, 10:21:16 PM
I prefer to do this as simply as possible: I send out my book, every week we read a chapter or two, and we make all comments here on the board. That system will support at least three novels at once without becoming insanely time-consuming.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 02, 2003, 11:47:10 PM
Yeah for Fell, for he comes up with good idea.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 03, 2003, 12:09:50 AM
k, I'm fine with that.

Now, which msg board do we use?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: fuzzyoctopus on December 03, 2003, 12:27:01 AM
Use writer's group so I won't feel tempted to read the threads all the time and fool myself into thinking I have time to join.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 03, 2003, 01:51:19 AM
Isn't temptation nice, though?

Come on, you know you want to...time shmime.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: EUOL on December 03, 2003, 03:15:24 AM
Personally, I would like it if you did it here.  Though I don't intend to take an active part, it would be nice to be able to check in occasionally and perhaps read something or comment.

You have a perfectly good message board already set up here.  So, why not use it?

As for why I'm not participating...well, THE WAY OF KINGS is 88 chapters long.  With eight people in the group, doing two people's chapters a week, that means each person gets to submit a chapter every four weeks, which means...it would take about seven years to get through my book.  

Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 03, 2003, 06:52:33 AM
Ahh, but EUOL. Some of the best things in life take years. Like the depletion of a uranium deposits half-life. 7 years? Why I've worked on projects for months as long as that. I would have other things to say but theres a depletion of stuff in me, so I need to keep it up for today.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 03, 2003, 08:01:55 AM
I kinda wanted to move it so it would have a little more privacy. But I'm waiting to seee what other people say.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 03, 2003, 09:31:30 AM
I'm okay with either place. And Tuesdays after 7 or 8 EST work if there will be a chat involved. And if there isn't, all the better.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 03, 2003, 12:18:24 PM
I say move it.

I need to get working on my story. But first, I was wondering if anyone had any advice for outlines. I have yet to draft up a successful one. An example would be most helpful if anyone is willing to let me puruse (sp?) it.

Secondly, does anyone have any books on the fae of the old world to recommend? I'm going to borrow a copy of Grimm's Faerie Tales from the library.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 03, 2003, 01:56:50 PM
I would prefer to keep it here, for the sake of simplicity. Why check two forums a day when I can only check one and cover everything? Besides, I don't see why privacy is an issue--even if the rest of the forum reads our discussion, what harm does it do?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Entsuropi on December 03, 2003, 08:14:48 PM
Because then the evil piglets could eat your chocolate eyeballs.

And i cannot take part in that chat. Thats what... 3am? Hahaha, no. But i'll make comments, and write some lame-o stuff sometimes i guess. And i can always ambush SE at 2pm.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 03, 2003, 08:22:24 PM
i assume you mean YOUR 2am, because I can't stay up that late anymore
my new job starts at 8, which means leaving by 7, which means waking not much after 6
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Entsuropi on December 03, 2003, 08:28:00 PM
2 PM you old fart.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 03, 2003, 08:29:32 PM
which is like 7am my time... right when i'm going  to work, you young poop
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 04, 2003, 01:54:30 AM
I think here is nice.  But if privacy is a concern...is there a way to gain that kind of privacy here at TWG?  A forum topic that only appears for specific members?  

It sounds complicated, but I try not to underestimate the miracle of computers and those who tell them what to do.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: EUOL on December 04, 2003, 04:49:01 AM
There's always the 'make X people moderators, then lock the topic' trick.  That would let writing group members post, and keep everyone else out.  Not privacy, but a little bit of quality control...
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 04, 2003, 07:08:39 AM
I think, EUOL, what Kije is worried about, as am I, is that someone may come along and steal our ideas.

And I'm fine with it being here or over there, but I will not eat it with green eggs and ham.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 04, 2003, 11:33:31 AM
I wasn't really concerned about privacy.  That was Saint.  But that whole idea-stealing thing doesn't sound very fun.  Hmmm.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 04, 2003, 11:34:41 AM
Even as I posted that I realized that nobody's going to be posting their stuff onto the site.  Just comments.  The works get distributed by email, right?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Gemm: Rock & Roll Star; Born to Rock on December 04, 2003, 11:59:15 AM
If thats the case then it should be fine.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 06, 2003, 01:34:31 AM
so... what did we decide in terms of what board to use? and who/when are the first ones being emailed? Do we have a comprehensive email list for that?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 13, 2003, 04:37:08 PM
Ok, I'm making some decisions on this here. i hereby order Fell and SaintEhlers (wait, that's me) to email out their manuscripts. The entire thing. Then we'll work on them chapter by chapter. Anyone else can email out theirs to the group as well, but we'll do Fell and SE's "Chapter 1" sections this coming week. We'll hold a discussion here. Fell, you're also respectfully requested to establish a forum for the writing group. I don't care what we call it. The Twigs or something like that seems appropriate. First chat discussion will be on the 23rd at 8pm Mountain, that's 10 pm for us easterners via AIM.

OK?
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: stacer on December 13, 2003, 04:58:09 PM
Sounds good to me.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 13, 2003, 05:00:56 PM
yes - thanks for taking the initiative.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 13, 2003, 05:31:58 PM
I will create a forum tonight, when I get back from wherever I'm going right now. Will our first discussion cover the first two chapters of each book, or only one? Or more--we can do a ton of reading between now and the 23rd.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: The Holy Saint, Grand High Poobah, Master of Monkeys, Ehlers on December 13, 2003, 09:49:28 PM
well, my chapters are kind of long. I only have 8, actually. So lets do one of each for the first one, and see how that goes. No problems reading ahead though.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Lieutenant Kije on December 13, 2003, 10:35:39 PM
If you have lots of chapters, Fell, we could do 2 of yours and 1 of Saint's.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Fellfrosch on December 14, 2003, 01:49:57 AM
Not a significantly huge number. We can just do one. I'll email it out to every address on SE's email.
Title: Re: Writing Groups
Post by: Mistress of Darkness on December 15, 2003, 11:58:18 AM
Well, on the 23rd, being so close to Christmas, I will be in CA, and though my mom just got a new computer, I doubt that the internet connection will be any more reliable than it was before.

I'll try and get comments to you both before I leave on Saturday.